Bathroom Drain Pipe Woe

I dunno
I've always seen the flange extensions - for when tiling & the existing flange is too low

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Anyone want to argue with Scuba Dave? I've never held one of those extensions in my hand, so I don't know if the sizing would be right or if the screw holes would fit outside the diameter of the old flange and led/oakum.


Everyone I've talked to suggests filling in the hole by building the floor up there, then putting new flange down, which would be over tile I put in. Seems the way to go... anyone?

And the job's complete.

How I did it:

I called a plumber. He came over chipped off some rough edges on the top of the cast-iron pipe to make it smooth. Then put a new flange on and had enough width to catch the wood and drill in to existing floor. He sold me the job and all parts for toilet installation, such as screws, flange, and wax ring for $131.00 after tax. He told me that floor didn't have to be built up underneath because flange covered up the hole.

Basically, the only thing I didn't know was to chip off the pipe to make it smooth and that the hole didn't need covering. I spent way more than if I would've done it myself, but without the knowledge to get the job done right, I would've never learned how to do it. Knowledge is good.

What do you guys/gals think of the cost? And the method of the completed job? I'm in the most southeastern corner of Wisconsin.

By the way, main big store does sell lead and oakum. Although the lead is some sort of plastic lead that doesn't need heating.

Any-hoot, I'll be happy to get my only toilet back in. Enough of a plastic bag and bucket for me! :}

I doubt if you could find very many plumbers that would even start their truck for $131. Do, assuming the workmanship is professional, you got a real deal. I can't comment on the "plastic lead" other than to say I would get some professional advice before using it. Good luck on the rest of your project.

131.00 is a good price to me. I paid around 285.00 for the same thing and the first plumber didn't do it right, (long story and wouldn't fix it) the next plumber came in and put another new flange in, around the same price if I remember correctly. The second plumber while using a torch set my smoke alarm off, and was yelling, " hey lady! can't you do something about that alarm!" So, standing there waving a towel didn't stop it while he was using the torch, so I had to stand on a chair above the flight of stairs and remove the alarm.

Some people are all heart.

I doubt if you could find very many plumbers that would even start their truck for $131. Do, assuming the workmanship is professional, you got a real deal. I can't comment on the "plastic lead" other than to say I would get some professional advice before using it. Good luck on the rest of your project

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I called a business in the yellow pages that has been around awhile. Mike, the plumber, told me he has been doing plumbing for 31 years, so I'm assuming he's on target with professionalism. Beyond that, he said he's worked in virtually every trade having to do with home remodeling and building. He told me he was giving me a deal because I had already done some of the job and he could tell that I would've done it myself and that I wanted to learn. He was kick-ass.

I won't be using the lead and oakum now anyways. Thanks for the farewell wishes, and thanks for all your help. I learned some new things, and that can't be beat!

131.00 is a good price to me. I paid around 285.00 for the same thing and the first plumber didn't do it right, (long story and wouldn't fix it) the next plumber came in and put another new flange in, around the same price if I remember correctly. The second plumber while using a torch set my smoke alarm off, and was yelling, " hey lady! can't you do something about that alarm!" So, standing there waving a towel didn't stop it while he was using the torch, so I had to stand on a chair above the flight of stairs and remove the alarm.

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Oh geez. Why did he use a torch?

Well, he was smoking cigerettes while he worked but I think it wasn't to light those, , I think it was for the lead & okum. Just my guess.

witch_wyzwurd said:

For painting, I did, because I was a professional painter.
For flooring, my next door neighbor, because he's a floor installer.
For electrical, I learned from a home remodeler he came over on a whim for free to teach me how to hook up an oven range. He taught me how to pigtail and about wires.
For plumbing, workers at hardware stores showed me how to kooh up pipes and use sawzaw for cutting pipe.
I'd hate to think what you think I did. Like you must think my home is half-way falling apart or that I used Elmers glue to glue everything together. Or better yet, Scotch tape. Why are you so negative?.


Thanks for your caution.

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Having a neighbor do your floor and smockmen tell you how kooh up pipes isn't the same as inspection.

Just an observation... there are always many ways to skin a cat and often they have both benefits and negatives. Often it is simply deciding what your willing to live with (and different people have different ideas on that) For instance many people talk about flange extenders to solve flange height issues but you probably wouldn't be very happy if you bought a new expensive house and later found a plumber had installed flange extenders simply because he misjudged his initial measurements. Yet they are used by many as a shortcut, time saver, problem solve and there are probably millions working successfully even though we all know what needs to be done to do it the right way.
I'm faced with a situation where I have 3" copper DWV and I'm in the process of a bathroom remodel with shower mods and toilet relo. Just look at the cost of 3" copper alone. Many would say just splice into things with ferncos and plumb the extensions with plastic. IT would take multiple ferncos. It could be done to code.
But for me the integrity of the original plumbing is a factor. I want to keep it to the same standard as new. There will come a time down the road when I might have to replace it all in a proper replumb but in the meantime I don't want to start musing it all up. If I was going to rip the house down in 5 years I might approach it differently. I've bought houses where I just deduct the whole cost of a replumb because the homeowner, over time, made multiple "little fixe" here and there.

It's your house and as long as you are comfortable with the solution and it meets code then it works for you.
On the other hand you might be surprised at the cost of doing it to original standards since you've done the grunt work like removing the toilet yourself and you'd be using the plumber just for their area of expertise. In the end what did you save if the buyer and their home inspectors deduct the cost to upgrade it down the road. And often once we see one issue, smart buyers just figure it's all going to be that way.

Otherwise (IMHO) the cast clamping flanges might be the best alternative if it can get a prper mating hold. But you should know the +/- of an insidevsoutside clamp esepcially depending on your pipe size. There again I've heard people say "it's only a powder room so no one should be doing ***x". Real plumbers just can't think that way.

I'm not a plumber but I've learned a lot from the people on these boards that are generous enough to share their expertise and yes sometimes their opinion, but usually their opinion comes from years of wisdom. You wouldn't be happy if you hired a plumber and he used dodgy methods on your new expensive house even if he was passing the savings on to you. On the other hand you wouldn't want gold plated shutoff valves if your plumbing is barely worth saving.

It's as simple as how would a Ritz Carlton expect their plumber to fix it versus the Bates motel......just decide where on that spectrum you want to be based on your situation.

Well, he was smoking cigerettes while he worked but I think it wasn't to light those... I think it was for the lead & okum. Just my guess.

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Is there a reason he wouldn't have just pried out the lead and oakum. I did, and it took me less than an hour to do. By the way, can you shut off that thing lady!

Having a neighbor do your floor and smockmen tell you how kooh up pipes isn't the same as inspection.

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No. The next door neighbor took a look at my installation.
As far as the plumbing... there's only so many ways you can glue together schedule 40 pipe or put a boot on or install kitchen drain pipe (especially when instructions come with).

Thanks Interlodge. My work has already been done.

ha ha, I tried my best to shut that alarm off.

Why and what he did with that torch I seriously, can't answer other than it was there and being used and something, smoked alot besides him.

I use the drill bit on lead and pry it out.
I use an old screwdriver.
I've never been able to melt it out.
Pouring a Lead Joint

What about putting in a new flange, do you have to melt the lead? If so, how does one do it?

Actually, while you were posting that, I was looking around and I found this, so, this kind of explains that he was using a torch for I guess, to melt the lead, which I assumed he was doing in the first place.

Anyway, the poster got a good price I would think so, according to what I paid. Twice.



Re: cast iron closet flange
Author: e-plumber (NY)
5 minutes Packy?

It takes about five minutes just to melt a ladle of lead, not counting the time to set up the joint, pack the oakum, pour the lead and caulk it.

I agree that it could be relatively quick job, but 5 minutes is pushing it.

e-plumber [mlb.mlb.com]

I am glad you edited your post Terry to add, Pouring a Lead joint; if it would had been there prior, I would not had bothered you with my question,

Thank you so much, such a wonderful post by Master Plumber Mark Weinhammer. Very, detailed. So well done. Great.

Did you put proper pitch or supports on your pipes? Did you make a "s" or a "p" trap? Long sweeps for change of direction? 6" above floodrim before the vents go horizontal? Proper size of pipe per dfu? C/O's at every change of direction? Good luck with that.

Deaf Ears I'm afraid.

[Quote ]As far as the plumbing... there's only so many ways you can glue together schedule 40 pipe or put a boot on or install kitchen drain pipe (especially when instructions come with).



Wow, I guess we have wasted our time in school and aprenticing eh? Codes? Inspections? Who needs em! I would be very interested to see your house and the plumbing u have done!