Ready for Concrete HELP toilet flange

**gdunbar** · 07-08-2005, 01:40 PM

Ok, so plumbers just left me with rough lines.
It's my duty to now patch all the concrete, attach flange, etc...
So he's left me with a 3 in ABS with a Flange attached (not glued) and it sits about 1.5 inches above grade. He says I can saw off bottom part of flange to make it shorter.
But he also said I should sink screws in the concrete (since I am patching) for the flange.
I dont quite get what he meant. You think he means put screws through flange into concrete?? He said use brass.

I still have tile to lay which probably will leave me with 1 inch too high.

Any ideas?
dad

**master plumber mark** · 07-08-2005, 03:33 PM

did you pay this guy to leave you "holding the bag"""

if he jsut recently did this work for you, the flange should

be flush as you wish it to be.......

you should not have to finish his work for him......

maybe he ran the whole drain too high and is hopeing you
accept the mess up as ok....

get hmi back ouit and tell him to install that flange
flush to the floor , not one inch too high..

**jadnashua** · 07-08-2005, 04:25 PM

Since you have new plumbing, you should attach the flange properly. The flange should sit firmly on top of the finished floor. So, since you have to now fill in the cement from what they tore out to get ready for the finished floor (I assume you offered to do this to save some money?), you need to figure out at what height to put the flange. Depending on the diameter of the pipe and the type of flange, internal for a 4" and external for a 3", you might have to leave some room around the pipe to allow for the flange to be glued onto the pipe once you get the floor finished. Take a close look at the flange. You might be able to put a concrete release agent on the flange, dry fit that piece on the pipe, put in your concrete, pull up the flange (or maybe a coupler you slid on the pipe), so there would be room to mount it later.

He suggested embedding the screws into the concrete as you put in the patch for the floor. If you have a carbide drill bit, it is not a big deal to drill anchor holes for mounting the flange after you get it poured and it cures. Drilling through tile can be another matter, but you can notch the tile so you don't have to actually drill through them.

Make sure the pipe doesn't move when you put in the concrete patch it needs to be vertical in both planes, or the flange won't sit flush on the floor (assuming your floor is flat!). Make sure before the cement sets to ensure it is vertical. My unprofessional opinion.

**gdunbar** · 07-08-2005, 05:09 PM

Yes, I told them I would do most of the connections. This was to save $$. I guess my main confusion is I didn't realize the flange needs to be bolted to the concrete. Trying to figure how to do this, and get it at the right height for the finished floor. What is the easiest way to do this? I read the reply, what is concrete release agent?? Right now I have a 10 foot long trench, and I'd like to concrete ASAP so I can get going on the floor. I'd like to mix conrete only once if possible.
Ideas? thanks for all your help in advance

Dad

**jadnashua** · 07-08-2005, 05:26 PM

The flange is what holds the toilet in place...you don't want to rely on the plastic pipe - you want the flange firmly screwed in place, then when you put the toilet down with the bolts, it will stay where you put it!

Since you won't know exactly what height your flange will be, don't glue it down until you have the finished floor in place. That means, though, that depending on the size of the pipe and the type of flange, one thatmounts inside or outside of the pipe, you may not be able to concrete all the way up to the pipe. So, if you put a coller around the pipe thick enough so the flange will slide over it, then put the concrete down with the pipe sticking up, you still have the chance to pull that collar off, cut off the pipe at the desired height, THEN glue the flange on after the floor is finished. The concrete will stick to whatever you probably use to make that coller, making it nearly impossible to get out unless it is either resilient (something like foam) or you put something on it that will keep the concrete from sticking - maybe some oil, or petrolium jelly, etc. One of the pros may have some better suggestions.

hj · 07-08-2005, 06:05 PM

I don't know about other plumbers, but I put a "wrap" around the pipe before the concrete is poured and then set the flange after the concrete and tile is put in place. It goes on top of the finished floor and then any extra pipe is cut off.

**gdunbar** · 07-08-2005, 11:31 PM

Yea, thats right. He mentioned something about wrap, but then he didn't do it.
What is the Wrap?? Then I can pour concrete, then tile then set the flange. And he did say if it is too high, just to cut off the bottom of the flange.This is the type that goes over the 3 in pipe.

And I can just use concrete screws to fasten the flange to the slab. Right?

hj · 07-09-2005, 05:47 AM

A wrap is either a preformed coil of corrugated cardboard that slips over the pipe, or you wrap several layers of cardboard around the pipe to create a void. If you do your own wrap tie it together with a tape of some kind, not wire.

**jadnashua** · 07-09-2005, 09:11 AM

For screws you could use something like Tapcons that literally screw into a pilot hole, or probably better, is a stainless steel or brass screw into a plastic anchor you put in the hole. The screws shouldn't get wet, but if they did, either the brass or stainless (stronger) screws wouldn't degrade as fast.

**gdunbar** · 07-09-2005, 07:58 PM

did the pour today. Check out how I propped the flange so it would be straight. It was off like by 1/4 or so. Ingenious. And yes I found the wrap at HD for .87$. I just used one layer of it and dry fit the flange for now. Then I'll remove after it dries etc...
No worries, the vent is going to be hid in a wall, dude said he couldn't break through footing to put the clean out where I wanted it. So now the clean out is going to be inside the vanity. Lame??