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Thread: Outdoor sub-panel for pool

  1. #1

    Default Outdoor sub-panel for pool

    I have to travel to the in-laws this weekend to install a sub-panel for their new above ground pool in the state of Louisiana. Here is my assumptions please tell me if I am wrong or off-base.

    Plan is to install a 50 amp sub-panel (outdoors) on a 4' high post near pool.
    Water-tight flex containing 4 runs of 4# copper, 2 hot, 1g 1N. 50amp breaker in main, 50 amp main breaker in sub-panel and smaller breakers (gfci) to the loads.

    Will a ground rod be needed or do I tie the ground back to the house panel?

  2. #2

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    #4 is overkill unless it's 3oo' from the source.

    Three #8's and a #10 ground will suffice for a 50 amp pool sub. A lot of in ground pools here use a 30 amp feed to a pool sub which covers a filter pump motor, a cleaner pump motor and the pool light(s).

    No G rod necessary here. Local ordinances may vary.

  3. #3
    Licensed Electrical Contractor Speedy Petey's Avatar
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    What type of "water tight flex" are you considering? I assume this will be underground.
    How close to the pool were you considering? The panel CANNOT be closer than 10' to the pool.

    A ground rod is required since this is a detached remote feeder and panel. If the panel were in the same structure as the main no ground rod would be required.
    You are also required to run an insulated ground with the feeder conductors in conduit completely back to the main panel.

    I REALLY think you need to read up on the codes involved with wiring and bonding for pool equipment.
    Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.

  4. #4
    Electrician Chris75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 220/221 View Post
    #4 is overkill unless it's 3oo' from the source.


    No G rod necessary here. Local ordinances may vary.


    yes a ground rod is required. read article 250.32

  5. #5

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    yes a ground rod is required. read article 250.32
    I was assuming a rod wasn't requires because I have never seen one and I have never installed one.

    We have lots of pools here. I have seen a hundred pool panels and installed maybe a dozen.

    No exceptions anywhere???

    Here's my pool. It's about 5 years old and the landscape is starting to really take shape.



    Last edited by 220/221; 06-02-2009 at 09:58 PM.

  6. #6

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    This is an above ground pool, all 120v equipment. roughly 110 feet to the main panel on the house. I do intend to bury the line minimum of 18 inches deep. NEC calls for the subpanel to be 10 feet from the pool?

  7. #7
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    Default Outdoor sub-panel for pool

    I have a 60 amp breaker on my main panel connected by 120' of #4/2 with a ground wire. The black and white wires are connected to the load lugs of the sub panel and the ground wire is attached to the neutral block. The outdoor panel box has 2 - 30 amp GFI breakers. One goes to an outlet for the chlorinator; one to the pump motor. The neutral bar is not bonded to the panel. Do I need to add a bonded grounding bar and a grounding rod at the sub panel? Is there any way to correct the grounding of the box without digging up the wire and adding a fourth (common) wire from the main?

  8. #8
    Licensed Electrical Contractor Speedy Petey's Avatar
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    No, not at all! What you have is extremely unsafe. You need an insulated neutral run with this feeder. The bare wire in the 4/2 cable should NOT be carrying all the current imbalance.

    You need to re-run that cable. If this panel is in a detached structure then you should have already had a ground rod there.

    PS- Next time start a new thread with your question instead of tacking it on to an existing thread.
    Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.

  9. #9

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    OK Speedy.. 3 8's and a 10#... 2 8's to the load bars, 1 8 to the neutral in the main panel .. #10 to the ground rod at the sub-panel..?

  10. #10
    Licensed Electrical Contractor Speedy Petey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ddennis View Post
    OK Speedy.. 3 8's and a 10#... 2 8's to the load bars, 1 8 to the neutral in the main panel .. #10 to the ground rod at the sub-panel..?
    You need a ground from the main panel to the sub-panel. Yes, in this case also #10.

    You then also need a #6 (if you can believe it) from the ground bar in the sub-panel to a ground rod. You can use a #8 to the ground rod if you can keep it completely out of harms way.
    Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.

  11. #11

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    Got it Thanks! Will post photos when done!

  12. #12

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    yes a ground rod is required. read article 250.32
    This isn't a seperate building or structure.

    Does 250.32 still apply?

  13. #13
    Licensed Electrical Contractor Speedy Petey's Avatar
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    You could claim interpretation of this section, but I think most inspectors would require a ground rod even if the panel were simply mounted to a post.
    Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.

  14. #14

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    You could claim interpretation of this section,


    That's what I'm going with. Like I said, in my area they are not requiring rods.

    I didn't read the whole section but saw "building or structure" and figured pool panels were exempt unless the equipment was in a pool house of some kind. The pool electrician guys generally mount them on a small rack made from a couple pieces of 1/2 rigid, the same type of conduit they use to feed it.

  15. #15
    DIY Junior Member Ana72's Avatar
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    Iíve just used the Square D outdoor sub panel that suits my swimming pool. I used a 2 pole breaker because itís suitable for service entrance equipment as Iíve work with. It also provides me a highly visible red indicator flag thatís why I easily identify tripped breakers. I just found this one thatís best for me. I do respect the sub panel that you used with and glad to know the information too. Iíve chosen this panel because Iíve experienced how it works for me as well. See you again!

    Thanks a lot and keep safe!

    "Online Source for Hot Tub Chemicals"

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