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Thread: how would you guys handle this? just had a Pegasus shower valve installed.

  1. #1

    Default how would you guys handle this? just had a Pegasus shower valve installed.

    a plumber just spent 8 hours replacing my shower valve which was behind a fiberglass wall and drywall. no smitty plate. i called a bunch of plumbers and even had some come over to tell me if they could do the job without a smitty plate (because it looks ugly). finally found one, but when he was done, i pointed out how the lever and also the spout was sticking out an inch instead of being flush against the base plate, as pictured on the shower faucet packaging. he said (a) it was a really difficult job (which it was, hence why all the other plumbers declined the job without using a smitty plate) and (b) he followed the specifications provided by the manufacturer's installation instructions. i told him that "a" is irrelevant because he gave me the expectation that he can do the job and he didn't meet that expectation. "b" is arguable, but do you think if the manufacturer did indeed provide inaccurate specifications, is it the plumber's job to know this to guarantee a reasonably accurate job? the lever and spout both stick out an inch and looks TOTALLY undone...i mean, there's an inch of piping and threading exposed between the base plate and the spout!

    i still paid him the $760 for his time and i asked him to come back to fix the lever and spout. when he comes back (i'm assuming this will undoubted be extra time i will pay him for since he thinks he didn't do anything wrong), i told him i will take pictures and measurements to show home depot that the specifications provided were faulty and cost me extra time and money. the shower valve and faucet is made by home depot's brand, pegasus, and yes, i know it's the highest quality brand.

    what do you think? any advice?

  2. #2
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    (Nearly) all valves have a min/max value that will still allow the trim to fit, and the handle still work. If it works, it is likely within the manufacturer's specifications. The range can be over an inch, and personally, I prefer it to be closer to the wall, but given there was little to any room to work, sounds like it is in the wall and working within the specs...if you wanted it in a specific place, it would have had to have been stated before the work was done as it sounds like it is okay. It may be impossible to move back without cutting a bigger hole, which you specifically didn't want. Sounds like he did a good job given the circumstances.
    Jim DeBruycker
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    Master Plumber Redwood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFK View Post
    The shower valve and faucet is made by home depot's brand, pegasus, and yes, i know it's the highest quality brand.
    You're joking I hope...

    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    (Nearly) all valves have a min/max value that will still allow the trim to fit, and the handle still work. If it works, it is likely within the manufacturer's specifications. The range can be over an inch, and personally, I prefer it to be closer to the wall, but given there was little to any room to work, sounds like it is in the wall and working within the specs...if you wanted it in a specific place, it would have had to have been stated before the work was done as it sounds like it is okay. It may be impossible to move back without cutting a bigger hole, which you specifically didn't want. Sounds like he did a good job given the circumstances.
    I agree...

    However the exposed pipe on the spout and the spout being an inch away from the wall is another matter and should be corrected free of charge.

    Can you post a picture of this installation?

    Is this a one man shop or a larger company that did the work?
    Last edited by Redwood; 04-17-2009 at 07:27 PM.

  4. #4
    Plunger/TurdPuncher kingsotall's Avatar
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    You're funny, Redwood.
    I just post cuz I like to see my avatar.

  5. #5
    Master Plumber Dunbar Plumbing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFK View Post
    a plumber just spent 8 hours replacing my shower valve which was behind a fiberglass wall and drywall. no smitty plate. i called a bunch of plumbers and even had some come over to tell me if they could do the job without a smitty plate (because it looks ugly). finally found one, but when he was done, i pointed out how the lever and also the spout was sticking out an inch instead of being flush against the base plate, as pictured on the shower faucet packaging. he said (a) it was a really difficult job (which it was, hence why all the other plumbers declined the job without using a smitty plate) and (b) he followed the specifications provided by the manufacturer's installation instructions. i told him that "a" is irrelevant because he gave me the expectation that he can do the job and he didn't meet that expectation. "b" is arguable, but do you think if the manufacturer did indeed provide inaccurate specifications, is it the plumber's job to know this to guarantee a reasonably accurate job? the lever and spout both stick out an inch and looks TOTALLY undone...i mean, there's an inch of piping and threading exposed between the base plate and the spout!

    i still paid him the $760 for his time and i asked him to come back to fix the lever and spout. when he comes back (i'm assuming this will undoubted be extra time i will pay him for since he thinks he didn't do anything wrong), i told him i will take pictures and measurements to show home depot that the specifications provided were faulty and cost me extra time and money. the shower valve and faucet is made by home depot's brand, pegasus, and yes, i know it's the highest quality brand.

    what do you think? any advice?


    Can't go any further with this thread till you post pics of the situation, and the picture of this box you're speaking of.
    Read what the end of this sentence means.

  6. #6
    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    Default faucet

    The picture on the box was a designer's idea of how it would LOOK nice, (without actually being installed), not necessarily how it would look in your shower. In fact the MAJORITY of installations do not look like the box, because plumbers know that if they tried to make it look like that, carpenters, sheetrocker, and tile men would conspire to make it impossible to put the handles and stuff on it afterwards and then SOMEONE would have to find out if the manufacturer made an extension kit, (not all do), so it could be assembled, and after that was done it would look EXACTLY likr yours does with the handle farther from the plate than the picture. Besides that, since he was working through the hole in the wall, he may have had to use the existing locations for the water connections which would have LIMITED how he positioned the faucet relative to the finished surface. There is only so much that can be done when using the existing piping and having limited access. You will not find much sympathy for your claim that he did not position the valve properly, as long as it was within the minimum/maximum points established BY THE MANUFACTURER. Spout/diverter location is something else and there is no reason that cannot be done properly. Using the words Pegasus, or Glacier Bay, and "high quality" in the same sentence is either an oxymoron or impossible. But as an aside, if I were working through the wall opening, I probably would not let you provide the valve unless I first determined that it could be directly connected to the copper tubing without using pipe adapters. Most of the Home Depot, and similar, stores do not sell that type of valve.
    Last edited by hj; 04-18-2009 at 08:07 AM.

  7. #7

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    yeah, i think you guys know what i meant. it was obviously a typo and meant to say pegasus isn't the highest of quality.

    i don't have a camera, but there's the base plate and then an inch of the nipple piping exposed and then the spout.

    as for the lever/handle, an inch of the sleeve is exposed and then there's the base plate.

  8. #8
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    The inch of the sleeve being exposed is normal. As for the tub spout he should be able to make the right adjustments needed to get the spout flush with the wall. If its a slip spout thats held on with a set screw over copper pipe he just needs to trim down the copper. If its a threaded spout he can remove the male adapter and use a slip spout in its place, or get an adjustable threaded spout. which will adjust to the Lean of the pipe coming out of the wall.

  9. #9
    Forum Admin, Expert Plumber Terry's Avatar
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    Since it's Pegasus, you won't find any information on a web site about them.

    Any other manufacturer, it would be a few clicks and you would have installation instructions.

    My limited experience with Pegasus tub and shower faucets was negative.
    Most plumbers would rather walk on hot coals then install one.

    I tried going to a link that used to work for Pegasus
    www.pegasusinfo.com
    But it now brings up a generic HD page.
    I guess there is no reason to give out helpful information on their changing products.

    If you can post a picture of the instructions that came with it, that could be useful.

  10. #10
    Plumber Cass's Avatar
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    The tub spout should be tight to the wall...generaly speaking the handle has no specific distance as long as it fits and operates properly, with out allowing water behind the finished wall...

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    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking dont worry about it

    I would not worry about fixing that pegasus faucet.

    it is 100% junk and probably wont last till summer anyway.


    It also might have been wise to pay the fellow with a charge card over a check he has probably aready cashed..that way you could have had him on the hook for 60 days....


    after working 7 hours and he still did not get it right,


    if he comes back, it will be a miracle..

    you are screwed on both counts.


    you can always complain to angies list and the BBB
    but i would not pay him anything more

  12. #12
    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    Default valve

    The handle can be tight to the plate, or 2", or more, away from it depending on how much latitude the manufacturer builds into the valve. The problem is when customers think that the way the valve is shown on the display board, or box's picture, is the ONLY way it should be installed, not realizing that those are just designer's concepts, (the valve is not even installed for those pictures, merely bolted to a piece of board), and have little application to the real world.

  13. #13

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    thanks guys. i'll try to get some pictures scanned at work on monday or so.

  14. #14

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    sweet! coastal plumbing just dropped by to take a look and they agreed to fix the spout free of charge (as it should be)!

  15. #15
    Plunger/TurdPuncher kingsotall's Avatar
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    Free plumbing┐ That raises my alerts just a bit...
    I just post cuz I like to see my avatar.

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