Stinky water, high iron, need softener and overwhelmed

[Chatterk]

One last thing, we have a sediment filter (before the water tank) and it doesn't take long after changing it and it's covered in junk. I have no idea how old the well is but from the looks of everything it could be mess down there. When we lived there I could believe the amount of gunk that came out of the faucets at times. Any bath water we used was discolored. It was a mess. So we continued to put it off because we knew it was going to cost a lot of money to do it the right way. Again, guess we should have tackled it before getting renters. Again hindsight 20/20.

[Chatterk]

Biermech, is a chlorinator something we can add in the future? How much space do they require? It would be the first stop the water makes, followed by the filter, than the water tank, lastly the softener? Thank you for your response. That may work well for us.

[speedbump]

You have a filter BEFORE the tank? That's a big no no! Now your trying to burn up your pump. This is what this filter can do being in front of the tank/pressure switch.

bob...

[sammyhydro11]

I understand your situation but if you want professional advice then you need to open your ears. I told you how the water needed to be treated. A chlorinator is not something that can be added in the future, it's required to treat your water properly. Like i said the water needs to be treated systematically.

sammy

www.tylerwellandpump.com

[Chatterk]

My mistake. I just confirmed it's after the tank. I've been in our basement a handful of times and I just thought it was before. My husband just explained this morning it is actually after the tank.

[Gary Slusser]

Chatterk, once you have the water analysis data, you will need some form of disinfectant, like chlorine, to oxidize the H2S, iron and any manganese. That will also kill any bacteria. Then a special carbon in a backwashed filter to remove the dirt from the water that oxidation causes and remove the chlorine. Then depending on the hardness in the water a softener. The softener would be optional because they can live with hard water and you could add the softener later. If you go with a softener now and not the rest, it will probably fail quite quickly and you may have to replace the resin to get it to work later.

I suggest my inline erosion pellet chlorinator and special mixing tank that is equivalent to a 120 gallon retention tank. Then the filter with a Clack WS-1 control valve and then the softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve. Depending on the size of the filter and the softener, usually around $2300 including UPS shipping. But I/you can't correctly size the filter or the softener until you know how much of what is in the water, and then the number of people, bathrooms ane the type of fixtures in the bathroom so you know the peak demand flow rate the filter and softener has to be able to treat. If you get that wrong, the equipment will not consistently remove everything from the water that they are supposed to.

BTW, you could buy a test kit at a hardware or other type store and do your own tests. Now Sammy may get a attitude over that (too) but don't pay any attention, you don't need target rifle accuracy at 3500 meters, a shotgun approach works very well. And you can't set up chlorine equipment without knowing how much iron you have or you can ruin the carbon.

[Chatterk]

Okay, we paid the $50 for the following results:

IRON .83 mg/l LOD: .06 LOQ: .21 Dil: 1 Method: 200.7

IRON
BACTERIA <1 cfu/ml LOD, LOQ, Dil: all 1 Method: IB

SULFUR
BACTERIA 10000 cfu/ml LOD, LOQ, Dil: all 1 Method: SRB

This is all we received on the sheet they emailed (after my husband pd)
Is this accurate? Were we overcharged?
I hope this helps. Please let me know if there is more information you need.
C

[Chatterk]

It's a 1200 sq ft home with 2 people living there, 1 kitchen sink faucet, and one bathroom with a tub/shower combo and sink in there. Plus a laundry room. That is it.

Thanks,
C

[drick]

>>IRON .83 mg/l

Thats nothing! Its enough to be a PINA and cause problems like in the toilet and tub though. Any water softener properly sized with the right media can pull that out! I have 14ppm iron. I'd take you water over mine any day.

One problem; I would question the accuracy of that test. I wouldn't think the iron concentration is high enough to be immediately noticeable in a glass of water as you have described.

Also your water test is not nearly complete and the bacteria is going to be a problem. You might get lucky and find out that shocking the well every few months keeps in under control. I would go to your local big box hardware store and buy a water test kit and see if the numbers match what you were given. Also you need to know the PH of your water.

-rick

[Chatterk]

I know when he was at our house he said our water was really hard and that it was 18 grains of hardness. Apparently these numbers aren't matching up huh?
I really wish we wouldn't of had to pay $50 for this. Bummer.

Any other thoughts from anyone? How much are the store kits? Does it provide immediate results that could steer us in the right direction so we could purchase a fleck or clack online?

Thanks

[Gary Slusser]

They charged you what they wanted to because they assume you are not going to buy from them but, they took samples to a lab, and paid the lab for the analysis, and got a few bucks for their trip to your place and their time. But if you are listing every thing the lab tested for, it is a very skimpy test but you don't need other tests.

Based on the size of the fixtures and number of people and bathrooms, you need smaller equipment and the delivered price would be less than the figure I mentioned.

[drick]

If all you are out to the water treatment company is $50 consider yourself lucky. Some people have lost thousands allowing them to install equipment that didn't work or didn't work for long.

The store bought test kits do provide immediate results. Like Gary said its more of a shotgun approach as opposed to an actual water analysis. It will put you in the ballpark. Not all kits are the same. Find one that will provide you with iron, manganese, Ph, hardness. IMO I'd still recommend an actual water analysis by an independent lab.

Also when you go to the house you need to know how many gallons per minute you well can deliver. Bring a 5 gallon bucket and time how long it takes to fill it from an outdoor faucet or if you have one in the basement right near the pressure tank thats just as good. You want as many gallons per minute as possible so bypass or remove any filters before you do this. Water softeners are somewhat forgiving, but actual water filters require a certain gallons per minute rate in order to backwash properly.

[Gary Slusser]

The store bought test kits do provide immediate results. Like Gary said its more of a shotgun approach as opposed to an actual water analysis. It will put you in the ballpark. Not all kits are the same. Find one that will provide you with iron, manganese, Ph, hardness. IMO I'd still recommend an actual water analysis by an independent lab.

Also when you go to the house you need to know how many gallons per minute you well can deliver. Bring a 5 gallon bucket and time how long it takes to fill it from an outdoor faucet or if you have one in the basement right near the pressure tank thats just as good. You want as many gallons per minute as possible so bypass or remove any filters before you do this. Water softeners are somewhat forgiving, but actual water filters require a certain gallons per minute rate in order to backwash properly.

A few helpful comments. They do not need to spend more money on tests.

They do not need to measure the 'well output' and doing it with a bucket is not a true test anyway. The 'time' is used to figure the drawdown gallons of the pressure tank, and that is used to size a pressure tank (to provide 60 seconds minimum off for the proper cooling of a submersible pump), not how many gpm the well can produce or the pump can deliver. That's because the boiler drain on a pressure tank, or the bath tub or other faucet, is not the same flow rate, it is lower, as the outlet pipe from the pressure tank will/can deliver for the successful backwashing of a softener or filter.

The only way to get the gpm from the well or a submersible pump is to pull the pump up and run it at the average pressure switch settings, on the ground while you time and then measure the gpm. That gpm will always be higher than measuring anywhere in the house, and that really isn't the peak demand gpm used to size equipment anyway. And you'd have to disconnect the outlet of a jet pump or the pressure tank to measure them correctly.

All softeners and backwashed or regenerated filters are flow controlled meaning, the drain line flow is controlled to X.x gpm based on the cuft volume and type of resin or mineral used. The softener they need, with a Clack WS-1 control valve, would have a 2.4-2.7 gpm DLFC (drain line flow control) and the carbon filter, with a Clack WS-1, will have a 5-7 gpm DLFC.

Any well or pump can deliver that volume of water for the length of time required, which is also controlled to the minute by the programming of the control valve IF the valve allows it, some do not, like a 5600 TC.

Chatterk, all you need now is to select where you want to buy the equipment and then find the money for it. You and/or your hubby can install anything I sell in about 3-4 hours, and with Sharkbite fittings without soldering. And if you use them, it would be like 2.5 hrs.

[Chatterk]

With the information I have given can anyone predict what size softener we would need. I'm leaning towards the fleck or clack.
Thanks,

[cacher_chick]

Thanks Cacher_chick. He was going to rent us a unit for $45 a month, plus $89 install. And potentially another $45 a month for a pellet unit and something else to take out sulfur. For $90/month plue $89.00 we could get a pretty nice unit. And at this point I'm put off by the Culligan man b/c his quotes would change and he would never email me anything when I asked. He'd just quickly tell me it over the phone. I almost went with him and at the very end called and backed out b/c I was getting such a bad vibe. At this point I don't really want to call back and move forward with it. I know the $540 in rental would buy a Kenmore and if it only lasts 1 year, it will pay for itself (vs renting a Culligan). This where all my thinking came from.

thanks,
C

The fact is that if the water is safe to drink, you have fulfilled your responsibility to the renter. If it were me, I would negotiate sharing the cost of the rental equipment with the person you have rented the house to.

1200 a year is less than many people pay for city water.