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Thread: Water comes up other sink when disposal is on

  1. #16
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    OK had to borrow a picture another poster used to show how they installed their sink , disposal and drain pipes. So it should look like this in Illinois. The only difference is they want you to use a double wye and have each trap coming of each part of the wye , and put a clean out adapter in the center pipe. As shown in the badly drawn illustration in the upper post.


  2. #17
    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    Apparently Illinois' code has gone downhill since I was there, unless that is different from the Chicago code. As an aside, that disposer trap is NOT properly vented, especially if it goes into a lateral arm which then goes to a vertical pipe. The disposer discharge, being from a "pump" can create enough velocity to cause a siphon past the second trap's outlet and deplete the trap seal. The problem with the lady's installation is that the tee is a simple straight slip tee, NOT a baffle tee, so excessive water is not forced to go down to the trap, but can backflow up to the sink when it hits the back of the tee. If she were in Phoenix, any of us plumbers could correct it, and get rid of the Mickey Mouse flexible pipe in the process.

  3. #18
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hj View Post
    Apparently Illinois' code has gone downhill since I was there, unless that is different from the Chicago code. As an aside, that disposer trap is NOT properly vented, especially if it goes into a lateral arm which then goes to a vertical pipe. The disposer discharge, being from a "pump" can create enough velocity to cause a siphon past the second trap's outlet and deplete the trap seal. The problem with the lady's installation is that the tee is a simple straight slip tee, NOT a baffle tee, so excessive water is not forced to go down to the trap, but can backflow up to the sink when it hits the back of the tee. If she were in Phoenix, any of us plumbers could correct it, and get rid of the Mickey Mouse flexible pipe in the process.
    HJ if you look at this illustration that the Illinois Plumbing code points to It shows a double wye fitting with a clean out installed in the middle. Also the code allows for two traps to be used on a common vent as long as they enter the pipe at an equal level, and the vent is installed vertically.

    b) Common Vent. A common vent, installed vertically, may be used for two fixture traps when both traps connect with a vertical waste at the same level.



    Also some where in the code they say this arrangement is only allowed on the kitchen sink. I will go digging for it in a bit and post the section.
    Last edited by SewerRatz; 03-01-2009 at 08:11 AM.

  4. #19
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    Well also I am posting what is allowed in Illinois. You should know the State's code is the bare minimum allowed. Counties, townships, and cities can make the code stricter but not less strict than the State code.

    In Chicago they want the p-traps installed like this when using a common vent for the kitchen sink. They still do not want the disposal and the sink basin on a single trap since that would be less strict than the State code, as well as the dishwasher either has to be installed on its own trap or on the tail-piece for the side with out the disposal.


  5. #20
    Consultant cwhyu2's Avatar
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    It`s called a branch tail piece that goes to the sink that the desposer is not connected to.What code do you follow? We are only allowed one trap per
    fixture.IPC code book.

  6. #21
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwhyu2 View Post
    It`s called a branch tail piece that goes to the sink that the desposer is not connected to.What code do you follow? We are only allowed one trap per
    fixture.IPC code book.
    As I quoted I follow the Illinois Plumbing code in post #14

    In tha tpost I posted the parts that the Illinois code addresses about a disposail installed on a sink.

    I wil post again what is right from the code book of Illinois on Plumbing and I will make the text Red and bold that pertains to seprate traps and not installing the the dishwasher into the disposail.

    Section 890.710 Food Waste Disposal Units

    a) Installation. Food waste disposal units shall be trapped separately from any other fixture or compartment, shall be connected directly to the sanitary drainage system, and shall be properly vented. Dishwashers shall not discharge into food waste disposal units. Units may have either automatic or hand-operated water supply control. (See Section 890.1130(a), (b) and (c).)

    b) Commercial-Type Grinders. Commercial-type food grinders shall be provided with a waste line at least 2 inches in diameter. (See Appendix F: Illustration D.)

    Section 890.770 Dishwashing Machines

    a) Domestic Dishwasher (Private Residence). When a domestic dishwashing machine drain line is connected to the house side of a trap from a sink, the drain from the dishwasher shall be carried up to the underside of the spill rim of the sink. Dishwashing machines shall discharge separately into a trap or tail piece of the kitchen sink and shall not connect to the food waste disposal unit.
    b) Water Supply Connection. The water supply to commercial dishwashing machines shall be connected through an air gap or by means of proper backflow protection, e.g., a non-pressure type (atmospheric) vacuum breaker or a dual check valve backflow preventer assembly (DuC), depending upon the circumstances.

    c) Commercial dishwashing machines shall indirectly discharge to a proper receptor connected to the drainage system or as permitted in Section 890.1010(a).

    d) Hot Water. A commercial dishwashing machine or similar dishwashing equipment that relies upon hot water for sanitizing dishes and utensils, rather than chemicals for sanitizing, shall provide rinse water at 180 degrees F., except for a single-tank, stationary-rack, single temperature dishwashing machine which shall provide a rinse water temperature of 165 degrees F., in accordance with Section 750.830(h) of the "Food Service Sanitation Code" (77 Ill. Adm. Code 750).

  7. #22
    Consultant cwhyu2's Avatar
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    I know Iwas just thinking out loud.Every community has it`s rules and it`s all
    to protect the health of the public.

  8. #23
    DIY Senior Member TedL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwhyu2 View Post
    I know Iwas just thinking out loud.Every community has it`s rules and it`s all
    to protect the health of the public.
    cwhyu2: You must consider this wonderful opportunity to invest in a bridge I have for sale...

  9. #24
    Consultant cwhyu2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TedL View Post
    cwhyu2: You must consider this wonderful opportunity to invest in a bridge I have for sale...
    How much ?

  10. #25

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    Thanks SewerRatz,

    I appreciate the help

  11. #26
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rlkeime View Post
    Thanks SewerRatz,

    I appreciate the help
    You are most welcome. If you need any help or advice feel free to click on the link in my signature and call me. Just ask for Ron

  12. #27
    DIY Senior Member TedL's Avatar
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    Ron, I have to say, I look forward to your posts.

    And when I redo my kichen in a year or two, I may plumb the sink/disposer as you show is required in Illinois, as long as it meets NY's current code. The wife would like getting rid of the long side-to-side tube.

  13. #28
    DIY Member Marty53's Avatar
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    I had this same issue after my kitchen remodel. It was fine for a couple of months.. then I think because we were running a disposer through 50 year old clogged galvanized pipes, it clogged so bad I couldnt get anything to drain after snaking for a hours.

    I ended up ripping out the basement ceiling and cutting out all the galvanized. This is what the pipes looked like:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  14. #29
    Master Plumber Redwood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty53 View Post
    I had this same issue after my kitchen remodel. It was fine for a couple of months.. then I think because we were running a disposer through 50 year old clogged galvanized pipes, it clogged so bad I couldnt get anything to drain after snaking for a hours.

    I ended up ripping out the basement ceiling and cutting out all the galvanized. This is what the pipes looked like:
    Looks like you made the right choice!

  15. #30
    In the Trades kordts's Avatar
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    Is that a tapper? How dare you soil it's habitat with old dirty pipes?

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