Toilet Flange: Is this ok?

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Hdmstng

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I'm remodeling my bathroom (completely gutted) and am getting ready to tile. The toilet drain elbow was replaced, and my plumber purchased a fit inside flange. He left with my a piece of pipe to cut once the floor is installed to set the flange. After reading on here about how the fit inside flange is to be avoided, I purchased the flange you see below.

The first couple of pics are of the floor before laying the hardibacker for reference. The flange is going to be too tall, the bottom of it is going to rest on top of the elbow even after the floor has been tiled. Basically the elbow is close to the subfloor. Would it be fine to just cut the flange about halfway (as seen in the pic) then fit the PVC pipe inside it, then trim the PVC pipe so that it fits into the elbow and the flange rests on top of the finished floor?

Is there another way I should be doing this?

Thanks in advance for any advice you all can provide!
HD
 

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Gary Swart

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Using an inside fit flange on 4" pipe is acceptable. It's the 3" that is frowned on. If I was doing the outside flange on your set up, I'd measure carefully and cut the PVC pipe to fit all the way into the flange and all the way into the elbow. Maybe cut the pipe a tad short to make sure everything bottomed out.
 
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Terry

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The spigot flange is the same as a hub flange and a section of pipe.
The plumber knew what he was doing.
 
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hj

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flange

IF the plumber gave you a spigot flange that inserts into that elbow, use it, assuming it has a metal ring. IF not get one, and use it. Forget about the stub of pipe and cutting the flange to fit.
 

Hdmstng

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Hi guys, thanks for all the replies. There maybe a bit of confusion, at least I know I'm confused! :confused:

From my understanding, necking down on a toilet flange is frowned upon and should be avoided. Below is a picture of what my plumber left with me.

That flange (3.0" OD) fits inside the PVC pipe (3.5" OD/3.0" ID) and the PVC pipe is cut to length to fit into the elbow (3.5" ID). Since the flange is short there would still need a bridging piece of pipe.

To avoid this necking down, I wanted to get a flange with a 3.5" ID that my PVC pipe (3.5" OD) would fit inside and use the short piece of PVC pipe to go to the elbow (3.5" ID) that is in place. The only issue with this is that the flange is going to be too tall, so I would have to remove ~1" of the 2.25" (leaving 1.25") for the PVC pipe to fit into.

And on a side note, I picked up some #12 2 inch stainless steel sheet metal screws to attach the flange (which ever one is picked) to the floor. The sub floor and tile is 1 5/8" thick, so that should give an extra 3/8" bite to the screws. Or should I get longer or different screws?

Thank's again for all the help!
HD
 

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hj

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flange

I would NOT use any connection which has a plastic flange, period. The elbow is close enough to the floor level so a "spigot" flange which is the same size as a piece of pipe would glue INTO the elbow, possibly after a portion of the spigot was cut off so it was the proper length.
 

Hdmstng

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Thanks for the quick reply! I'm starting to get a better understanding. I measured from the inside part of my elbow (where the pipe would rest) to the top of the finished floor, and it is 3.5". Do they make spigot flanges that will go down that far? I take it they would be most likely at a specialty plumbing store and not the big box stores?

Thanks again!
 

Gardner

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What is the anticipated distance from the finished floor down to the top of the hub? It looks in your first picture that you have the hub just under a 3/4 plywood subfloor. With 1/2 CBU + 3/8 tile and thinset, you have about 1.5 inches. That seem right?

This is just uneducated opinion and conjecture, but I would reason that your average hub is not more than 1.5 inches deep and it would be reasonable to cut off the extra length of your outside fit flange so that it fits, so long as you have a width of 1.5 inches left to solvent weld.
 

TedL

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So longs as the screws pass through the plywood subfloor, you're OK. As noted above, you definitely want to use a flange with a stainless ring. Not plastic, not plain steel.
 

Hdmstng

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What is the anticipated distance from the finished floor down to the top of the hub? It looks in your first picture that you have the hub just under a 3/4 plywood subfloor. With 1/2 CBU + 3/8 tile and thinset, you have about 1.5 inches. That seem right?

This is just uneducated opinion and conjecture, but I would reason that your average hub is not more than 1.5 inches deep and it would be reasonable to cut off the extra length of your outside fit flange so that it fits, so long as you have a width of 1.5 inches left to solvent weld.

I have the floor in, and it measures 2 inches from the top of the hub (and by hub I assume you mean elbow) to the top of the finished floor. I would need to take off about 3/4 to 1 inch of the flange, that should leave about 1.5 inches of the flange left to solvent weld.

Although from what Terry and HJ have said, it sounds like there might be a toilet spigot flange that is a single piece that is at least 3.5 inches long. Something like that would fit right into the elbow with only a bit of cutting. I haven't seen anything like that at the big box stores, so maybe it's at a specialty supply house? Otherwise, I was just going to make my own as described above.

Thanks for the help!
 

Jay Mpls

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Leave the piece of pipe in and tile up to it.
Glue the pipe in cut it flush with the floor.
Get a STURDY flange and use the tabs not the long slots.
Glue it in.
Drill pilot holes through the tile.Sdrew the flange to the floor.
Set your toilet.
 

Hdmstng

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The spigot flange is the same as a hub frange and a section of pipe.
The plumber knew what he was doing.

My plumber left me with a flange that would fit into a 3" pvc pipe, not the hub of the elbow. I found the instructions he left me and it was to cut a piece of 3" PVC pipe and solvent weld it into the hub. Then then the flange would fit into the 3" PVC pipe. But from reading on here, necking down to fit in a 3" pvc pipe is not a good idea.

Instead I found the spigot flange as you suggested Terry that would fit inside the 3" hub of the elbow. Problem is the spigot flange will only go into the hub about 1/2". This is due to the fact that that with the installation of 3/8" plywood, 1/4" backer board, plus tile/mortar, the finished floor is about 1" higher than before.

1) Do they sell 3" spigot flanges with an extra long tail? I looked at Sioux Chief and Genova and was unable to find one. If someone knows of one, a link would be great.

2) Should I just put a stub of 3" PVC into the hub and use an inside 3" closet flange? It'll neck down, but no chance for a leak and I could be done with it. (That was what my plumber left me)

3) Put in a stub piece of 3" PVC into the hub and use an over the pipe closet flange. To do that I would have to cut the flange about 3/4" off the bottom of the tail so it wouldn't bottom out on the elbow, the Sioux Chief flange I have would still leave about 1 1/4" to solvent weld. I'm worried more about leaks, although I'll be dang sure to get the weld right.

Option 1 is my first choice, if the spigot flange with an extra long tail is out there and you can point me in the direction, I'm all for it.

Between options 2 and 3, chance of slow drain vs a leak.

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I really want to do this right. I'm actually going to be moving out in a few months, and want to leave this the right way for whomever is going to buy my place.

Thanks again.
 
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