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Thread: Eliminate S drain and vent question

  1. #1
    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Default Eliminate S drain and vent question

    I recently remodeled my bathroom and I admit, some of the plumbing was a quick job, to get the bath back up and running after 2 months of being torn apart. (I have a 3 y/o whom doesn't care for showers and wanted her bathtub back!) When the plumbing was done, I had some obstacles to work around, so I did what I could and now am trying to clean it up and make certain it is done correct.

    I have tried to label the picture to make things clear. From my understanding what I have is an S trap for the tub. My plan is to get it correct and make it into a P trap. I plan to drop the vertical pipe, running into the P, down several inches to where it is inline (proper slope 1/4" p/f slope) with the 4x4x2 fitting. I illustrated this in the picture with a white line drawing. My question is, can I put a 90* fitting, running horizontal, off of the 4x4x2 or should I turn the 4x4x2 about 45* and have the run go straight in? The horizontal 90* bend would be right where the white * is in the picture. This would keep me from having to cut the pipe leading to the 4x4x2 and rotating it about 45*. Either way is fine, just less work if I can install the horizontal bend....
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    Last edited by Master Brian; 01-16-2009 at 09:24 AM. Reason: typing

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    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Next part of this question is, do the 90's in the yellow circle cause any issues? Again at the time, I had to do this to get around some waterlines, etc. If need be, I can now go straight down. If it is ok, then I'll leave it, as I don't need more work.

    Are there any other clear issues with the plumbing that is shown? The other line in the pictue is the drain for the pedestal sink, it currently has an AAV venting it, so I didn't want it going into the 4" stack that the tub drains into.

    Thanks for any help, I will have a few more questions regarding this setup, but will wait until this is settled.
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    One who lurks Basement_Lurker's Avatar
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    Your two 90s don't pose a problem other than impeding water flow. You are best to have two 45s there instead if you need to make the offset. However, it is best to just have the line drop straight down into the trap.

    Since you have a fernco fitting there, you can easily cut out that 4x4x2 san tee and glue on a new one and reposition it properly so your tub p-trap drains directly to it, and then reconnect your stack with the fernco and a short piece of 4".

    I hope you plan to support your pex lines better than what that picture shows. If you are planning to leave them hanging there like that, you should use metal bend supports.

    And just out of curiosity, is there any particular reason you like to use reducing bushings everywhere instead of an actual reducing fitting?
    Broken promises don't upset me. I just think, why did they believe me? -Jack Handy


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    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basement_Lurker View Post
    Your two 90s don't pose a problem other than impeding water flow. You are best to have two 45s there instead if you need to make the offset. However, it is best to just have the line drop straight down into the trap.
    Good to know, that copper line is still in the way of a straight drop, but it will be gone, soon enough. That's when I could go to the straight drop, but I don't want to do extra work, just to do extra work. Right now the tub drains 10x faster than any tub I've had before. Maybe because I have 2" drain, where I believe 1-1/2" is the norm. I do get a gurgling, is all of this why?

    Since you have a fernco fitting there, you can easily cut out that 4x4x2 san tee and glue on a new one and reposition it properly so your tub p-trap drains directly to it, and then reconnect your stack with the fernco and a short piece of 4".
    So that is better than putting in a 90* or 45* bend? Will do....

    I hope you plan to support your pex lines better than what that picture shows. If you are planning to leave them hanging there like that, you should use metal bend supports.
    Those are actually supported everywhere else pretty well, in fact there are the nailed in supports (like the 3/4" line has) right out of the picture. It's just right there they are lacking. I was wondering if I should install a bend support. I just couldn't do it until a few days ago, as I ordered a bunch online and they just came in a day or two ago. They are plastic, not metal. Does that matter?

    [qoute]And just out of curiosity, is there any particular reason you like to use reducing bushings everywhere instead of an actual reducing fitting?[/quote]
    I wondered if that would come up. The actual reason is two-fold. 1st the closest lumber yard doesn't have the reducing fittings and it's hard for me to get to the plumbing supply by 4:30 during the week. 2nd, I wasn't sure exactly how this all was going to go together until I started putting it together. That added to the fact, that the bushings were readily available and the actual fittings weren't made sense to me. I'm guessing there isn't a problem using them is there???

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    In the Trades Gary Swart's Avatar
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    You should replace the Fernco connecter with a banded coupler. What you have is no approved for above ground use. I see no problem with the bushings. It looks to me like when you finish fixing the problem area, you will have a good installation.

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    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Swart View Post
    You should replace the Fernco connecter with a banded coupler. What you have is no approved for above ground use. I see no problem with the bushings. It looks to me like when you finish fixing the problem area, you will have a good installation.
    I didn't know that about the Fernco connecter, what are they for? Burried installations? If so, can I ask, why they are ok burried, but not above ground? When you say banded, I am assuming you are referring to the couplers with the corrogated (sp?) metall wrapping them. That's what I've always seen, but I thought an inspector, on my previous house, had told me they weren't legal and I kept hearing people talk about fernco this and that....

    Also, what is the difference between the two?

    Thanks!

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    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    The rubber bushing in a no-hub is thinner, has a stop ridge in the middle, and is supported so any lateral pressure won't cause the pipes to become offset. Under ground, assuming you properly bed the pipes, it is supported and not hanging in air, so the thicker rubber connector doesn't offset.
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    In the Trades Gary Swart's Avatar
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    What Jim said plus, a Fernco sleeve uses a stainless steel clamp on each end and is to be used underground. For example, PVC pipe being joined to cast iron that is buried. You may have misunderstood what you were told or the person gave you wrong information. In real life, that Fernco will probably last forever and do a good job, but an inspector will not approve it.

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    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Very possible it was a miscommunication, but thanks for clarifying.

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    Plumbing Contractor C NUMB's Avatar
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    Down here in my neck of the woods a no hub band is only legal on PVC as long as you use PVC no hub fitting adaptors. The fernco is used here whether under or above ground.


    Is there a reason to even have that san tee in the stack for the tub drain? Can't you just cut a wye in the 2" run on the sink waste line. Also, san tee's on there back as the one for the sink waste line are illegal in Florida, just an fyi if ya venture here.
    I'd Rather Be FISHIN'

  11. #11
    DIY Senior Member Master Brian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C NUMB View Post
    Down here in my neck of the woods a no hub band is only legal on PVC as long as you use PVC no hub fitting adaptors. The fernco is used here whether under or above ground.


    Is there a reason to even have that san tee in the stack for the tub drain? Can't you just cut a wye in the 2" run on the sink waste line. Also, san tee's on there back as the one for the sink waste line are illegal in Florida, just an fyi if ya venture here.

    The reason for the san tee in the tub side is so the tub has a vent. Otherwise it would vent through the AAV, the 4" vent is there, figured might as well use it!

    As for the san tee on it's back, what is preferred? A "Y"? Can I ask what is wrong with the san tee on it's back?

    I'm no expert, but like to learn. I basically put back what was there in cast, with the exception of few things that Y'd together before entering the main line. Now everything dumps into the main drain independentally. Before, I had the tub and the upstairs double vanity dumping into the main stack after meeting at a 2" Y, which Y'd into another Y at the main line, which leaked.

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