Need help installing Toto using extra thick wax ring

I was lucky enough to purchase a defective Toto Drake bowl the other week and had to buy a new one yesterday. My plumber of course is going to be charging me again if I want him to do the install, so I'd like to give this a try on my own...but I desperately need help!

I have tiled floors over concrete in my 1962 home and the guy who installed the tile removed the toilets and put them back on and advised me that if I ever move them, I should be aware that he needed to use two wax rings so that they would be thick enough. I never had a problem with those toilets, but I just wanted to upgrade to the Toto Drakes.

The plumber had used a Hercules Johni-Ring. When I removed the defective bowl, the plastic cone inside the wax ring didn't really make sense to me--it didn't seem to fit all that great and come to find out, most posters on this site advise AGAINST using them. So, my questions are:

1) Should I go buy a double thick wax ring with no cone or two regular thickness rings with no cones, and what brand would you all recommend?

2) Should I put the ring(s) on the toilet flange or the floor flange before installing the toilet, AND do I really want to do the gentle twisting and rocking that I've read about elsewhere or do I just set the toilet down, don't mess with it, and tighten the bolts?

3) Do I need to clean off every little bit of wax from the old ring or just the majority??

4) Anything else I should know or does someone have a link to the BEST toilet installing walk-thru out there?

Thanks,
Sonia

Install closet flange extension rings to extend the flange up to the right level. See below.
Use a single wax ring without a plastic horn.

What was wrong with the Toto?

Follow Redwood's advice. Next to Terry Love, he probably has installed more Toto's than anyone. He did leave a couple of questions hanging. Just wipe the worst of the old ring off, mostly for neatness. Set the new ring on the newly installed flange ring Redwood described, then lower the toilet straight down over the flange bolts so that the horn on the bottom of the toilet engages the hole in the wax ring squarely. You can't see it, but reasonable care will be sufficient. Once the toilet is engaged and is holding the toilet, use slight twisting combined with body weight to push the toilet down. When the base of the toilet is resting on the floor all the way around, you're there. The nuts on the flange bolts are not intended to pull the toilet down, just to prevent it from moving, so just snug them down. There is one more suggestion to the job. Before you bolt the tank to the bowl, take a piece of sandpaper or emery cloth and sand around the bolt holes in the bottom of the tank. Don't make a Federal case out it, just get any rough spots that might happen to have been left and could prevent getting a good seal. Finally, relax! Setting a toilet is really pretty simple.

extender

Neither of the previous answers told you that you MUST put a sealer between the flange and the spacer, but you do have to do so. An extra thick #10 wax ring always has the funnel, and if you use two wax rings, then the top one should have the funnel so it stays in alignment with the regular one on the bottom.

I know how everyone feels about the plastic horn but that answer makes sense too as the funnel won't bottom out on the flange.

Only slightly confused

My Toto was missing the right front point of contact and you couldn't tighten the tank enough to meet the back POC, so the tank would move if you sat back against it. Thanks for the advice so far! I got what you're saying Gary, only a couple more questions for Redwood and hj:

I'm not sure if an extender is what I need? Here is a picture of the closet flange(?) and it seems high enough, doesn't it?

If I do NOT need an extender, do I still need a sealer? If so, can you elaborate, hj? Also, I'm in Tempe and went to Central Arizona Supply..I asked them to give me an extra thick wax ring, but i'm pretty sure what they gave me is just regular--what kind of brand of #10 ring with the funnel should I buy?

Different areas will all have different brands available. The numbering is fairly standard between brands, they are usually made by the same place just packaged differently for the different distributors. A #1 and #5 are the most common. You should see a noticable difference in amount of wax from a 1 and a #10. Your flange looks high enough to not need to worry. When u put the bowl down on the floor, if you don't feel a squish, then u may need more wax.

That flange appears to be flush with the finished floor.
If it is a single wax ring without the horn will probably be fine.

I did it!

Ok, so I got the master bath toilet installed, and it seems fine

The hall bath was a little different and I have one last question. The plumber had two wax rings in there--one without a funnel down in the closet flange and then one with a funnel on top of that. But when I pulled the toilet, there was no wax stuck to the bottom of the toilet (the toilet had been rocking and that is why I pulled it. The floor is level and with two other toilets I've never had a rocking problem or had to use shims).

So I have my extra thick wax ring with the funnel and I need to know if I can leave the "like new" wax ring without funnel down in the flange and put my new wax ring on top of that?? Or is there such a thing as using too much wax and I should take that other ring out and just use the new extra-thick with funnel? The drop down from the top of the flange (that is flush with my tile floor) to the inside lip is about 2 inches. I took a couple pics:

OK, I have not put in that many commodes, but when I do I have always used the wax with the horn (even with a single wax ring) since I thought it was nice insurance ... please educate me on what the drawbacks are to these funnels ... I just ordered a toto drake from the supply store and shall arrive Friday (for my house and finally say good bye to my AM Plebe double flusher). Thanks.

There have been numerous comments on the wax rings with the plastic horns. It is almost unanimous that these do more harm than good. It the flange is set on top of the finished floor as it is supposed to be or even if it is slightly lower that the finished floor, a single wax ring is sufficient. It seems to me that novices become paranoid about getting a seal when then can see it occur and think that that funnel thing will give them insurance. Well, it not only does not make a surer seal, it usually causes problems. If the flange is well below the finished floor, then the extension rings are useful to achieve the height that will allow a wax ring to seal. Use sealant between these extensions as previously noted.