Water Well Chlorine system

[greyson]

I have a new home with a new water well. The contractor ran a 12/2 out to the pressure switch. The well is working great but i want to add a small chlorine pump on the system so that it will come on when the well kicks in. They did not run a neutral so i cant just use one of the legs off the 220 volt. The chlorine pump is 110 volts. Any suggestions?
D

[speedbump]

You could buy a 220 volt feed pump. They aren't common, but are available.

You could do like a lot of other pump installers and filtration guys do. Use the green/bare ground wire as a neutral. It's a major code violation, but is done all the time unfortunately. By the way, I'm not recommending that, just bringing it to your attention so as to hopefully deter you from doing it.

The other thing you can do; is use a flow switch. Install the switch somewhere in the ingoing pipe to the home near a 115 volt outlet. Use that power to run the feed pump instead of the pressure switch. If you have sprinklers, this is a must do anyway to save overloading the home with chlorine.

bob...

[Gary Slusser]

Or a much better choice is my inline erosion pellet chlorinator and 12" x 65" bottom drain mixing tank.

Both parts have a constant 21 gpm SFR (Service flow rating). It comes in continuous flow as long as the pump runs or not versions. The continuous version is used for filling cisterns (regardless of size) or irrigation.

Both versions have a wide range of adjustable dosage. No moving parts and no need for any electric or wiring.

It will cost less than a solution feeder and its required properly sized retention tank. It will take up much less space, the chlorinator hangs in the plumbing, and there will be much less maintenance and no baby sitting that solution feeders require.

What and how much of it is the chlorine being used to treat?

[Gary Slusser]

I'm sure he has a need for a disinfectant or oxidizer and chose chlorine.

What difference does it make as to why he needs either or both?

[sammyhydro11]

A lot of treatment applications are misapplied. I removed a chemical feed system from a customers house where they were charged 9000.00 and all they needed was a neutralizer and water softener. It was installed by a company that claimed they knew what they were doing. When they called me they said they were having a problem with the chemical feed pump. I asked them why they had one to begin with and had them send me their original water report. It turns out they had less than 2 parts iron and low ph. To make a long story short, i installed the correct equipment and it cost them less than half of what the wrong equipment was.

So thats why you ask......

sammy

www.tylerwellandpump.com

[Gary Slusser]

A lot of treatment applications are misapplied. I removed a chemical feed system from a customers house where they were charged 9000.00 and all they needed was a neutralizer and water softener. It was installed by a company that claimed they knew what they were doing. When they called me they said they were having a problem with the chemical feed pump. I asked them why they had one to begin with and had them send me their original water report. It turns out they had less than 2 parts iron and low ph. To make a long story short, i installed the correct equipment and it cost them less than half of what the wrong equipment was.

So thats why you ask......

sammy

Are you trying to say I misapply equipment?

Frankly I do not believe anyone would pay $9000 for a solution feeder.

I have already asked; "What and how much of it is the chlorine being used to treat?

BTW, solution feeders are used to control pH too. And you cost the guy $4500 MORE than than the $9000 you say he already paid. And that was for an AN filter and softener!! What a rip off.

[Gary Slusser]

Getting as much information as to WHY something is needed is essential to make sure that equipment is not misapplied. That would be the professional approach.

How can you "be sure"? Chlorine is used for different applications. Making assumptions is what I try to avoid.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

Now you're calling me unprofessional. That's a personal attack.

How can I be sure.... because I have 4-5 times the experience you have in water treatment and using chlorine. But, what other applications is chlorine used for other than as a disinfectant and an oxidizer?

[sammyhydro11]

Gary,
along with that soulution feeder the guy had a retention tank, a 2 cubic ft. carbon filter, and a water softener. The ph was not being treated with the chemical feed system. They had a ph of 5 so i treated the water with a 2 cubic ft. neutralizer and a 1 cubic ft. water softener, completely replumbed with 1" copper pipe and a 3 valve by pass. I even by passed 2 outside spigots for them. The total came out to 4300.00. I see them once a year for service and they are very happy with their system.

I think you get nervous when people start questioning the way you approach people about their systems. You sound like a wounded cat being cornered by some pit bulls. The very first thing you should be asking people is for a complete water analysis so you can give them the correct advice.


Andy,
i allways start with a standard water analysis form a certified lab and go from there. These people had no idea about how to treat their water and left it in the hands of this so called professional company. I didn't even try to sell them anything. I simply told them the correct way to treat their water and how much it would cost. One month after trying to get the original company out to explain themselves, they called and told me to install my system. They appreciated the way i handled it and because of that i have lifelong customer.

sammy

www.tylerwellandpump.com

[Gary Slusser]

Gary,
along with that soulution feeder the guy had a retention tank, a 2 cubic ft. carbon filter, and a water softener. The ph was not being treated with the chemical feed system. They had a ph of 5 so i treated the water with a 2 cubic ft. neutralizer and a 1 cubic ft. water softener, completely replumbed with 1" copper pipe and a 3 valve by pass. I even by passed 2 outside spigots for them. The total came out to 4300.00. I see them once a year for service and they are very happy with their system.

Let's see.... he had a solution feeder and retention tank, obviously to be able to inject chlorine to oxidize or disinfect something, and you sell him an AN filter to control the pH. I would not have done that, especially since he was using chlorine, which is the only other reason to have a feeder, and you have not addressed the need by replacing it with the AN filter.

Also, he had a softener and you say you sold him another one. And a 1.0 cuft at that which is only good for a 1-1.5 bathroom house due to the softener's constant SFR gpm barely able to service his peak demand gpm.

IMO that is serious misapplication of equipment! And at premium prices. I sell 1.0 cuft softeners for between $500-625 delivered. And a 2.0 cuft AN filter for $850-925 delivered.

I don't recall seeing on your web site where you are licensed in MA to do plumbing. Do you need a license there? I have never had to have a license.

[Gary Slusser]

I don't see anything OBVIOUS. Likely, maybe, but not obvious. Did he mention the use of chlorine or is that an assumption? Maybe it is an alum feed, or a hydrogen peroxide feed,or a sodium hydroxide feed, or a soda ash feed, or a mix of chlorine and soda ash feed, all of which I have seen with retention tanks. I just don't know given the information. So I don't want to make any assumptions unless I say just that...obviously. "...only other reason..." OK, sure.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

Yes and all but one of them is used to either disinfect or oxidize something in the water BUT, Sammy said the guy didn't know what the feeder was for. Frankly that is difficult to believe, so it seems you are now assuming it was used for alum and not as a disinfectant or oxidizer because Sammy did say it was not for pH control.

[sammyhydro11]

Gary,
you should know all the details about something before making comments. The people were told that the 2 parts ferous non bacteria iron needed to be oxidized. They had 0 bacteria in the water and their ph was not being handled at all. They also had no odor to the water at all.The water softener had parts missing from the home owner messing with it and was a junk brand to begin with. I also installed one that has a fine mesh resin with a flow rate of 10 GPM. I make a full and complete analysis of the situation before i give my opinion on water treatment and because of that my customers are 100 percent satisfied. When my systems need service Gary, they call me and i'm at their door step. Not hundreds and hundreds of miles away in some mobile home. When it comes to plumbing licenses, i dont have one. I have 4 licensed plumbers on hand that will pull permits at the drop of a dime for me. All my work is done within the codes and i am hired by plumbers in my area to install systems for them. I am a licensed well driller and i have an NGWA Certification.To ad to my license and certification I am currently studying to take my CWS exam. When i get that i will covered in every aspect of my trade. What qualifications do you have MR. Slussler???? Every time someone gets into arguments with you it stems from you giving some incorrect advice. You have been kicked off a lot of other sites.....i don't wonder why.I could also care less what you charge for your systems. What i sell is a high end product because of the quality and my prices are also based on some of my competition. People will buy something from you and then they have to beg a plumber to install it for them. Or like Home Depot or Lowes, you make the homeowner think that they can do it themselves just so you can sell them your product.

sammy

www.tylerwellandpump.com

[Gary Slusser]

Sammy, you should know all the details about something before making comments.

IRB can come and go. Fine mesh resin has a higher pressure loss than the same volume of regular mesh resin.

My prospective customer won't buy from a local dealer and 98% do their own installation and, they do not want to call a local dealer to fix their equipment because of the price and the possibility of the dealer or his service guy getting it wrong. They want to fix it themselves.

A person that wants to depend on a local dealer for sales and service won't be contacting me or buying from me. Thereby it doesn't matter where in North America or Mexico I am as long as I have cell phone and internet service and you shouldn't concern yourself about me or any of the things you seem to be going on about.

My qualifications, ummm I hardly have any book learnin' and the last was like 19-22 years ago, no licenses, I don't do no stinkin' installations or what you call service and I got no books of my own. I guess that's why I only do a quarter mil of sales a year sitting in my briefs if I care to, in my motor home (currently in SW AZ at $2.87 per day [yes $2.87]), on my cell phone for an hour to an hour and a half with each prospective customer teaching them all about whatever types of equipment they need and taken' credit card info and shippin' addresses. Maybe that's why only 7 or 8 out of 10 people that call me buy from me. If you think I could improve all that and you want to make suggestions of how, I'm all ears as they say.

[sammyhydro11]

sure Gary whatever you say.............


sammy

www.tylerwellandpump.com