Cast Iron Drain to Sewer 90 broke... Now what?

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LT_DIY

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Hello everyone,

I've been having a lot of success with my home remodel by reading this forum, the UPC, and a few books.... until now. :) Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
I was removing the 4 inch cast iron drain stack with plans to replace most of it with 3 inch ABS, adapting using a Fernco donut to a short vertical section of the cast iron left in place. The snap cutter sure worked great.
The problem is my unexpected discovery that the cast iron 90 degree long sweep with cleanout that carries the the vertical drain stack out the foundation to the sewer run was broken. As soon as I removed most of the cast iron stack, the sweep visibly broke out of the foundation about an inch, and later fell out. By visual inspection seeing the rust and very wet mud below the break, I can tell its been there a while; this also explains the water marks below it on the foundation wall.
Now what do I do?

snap_cutter.jpg

I see two options: 1) get a rubber adapter, either donut or coupling and adapt a new ABS long-sweep clean-out at the break. 2) go outside and dig down to the pipe run and make the same connection, with perhaps more room to work. There are probably other options you experienced guys can think of.

I'll attach a couple of pictures to show the situation.

Any recommendations?

Thanks.
 

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Terry

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I don't see how you would connect to this.

If it were my house, I would be thinking of digging outside and seeing if I can connect there.

Approved couplings on the inside would be shielded couplings that prevent the pipe from shifting.

Wow, that job kind of got big on you.
 

NHmaster

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Not sure where your local is. Some will allow Fernco or mission band couplings under ground, some not. Either way though you're going to have to dig down outside the foundation and snap off a short piece of the old C.I. so that the connection does not lie inside the foundation. Yours is a good example of why it is against the code to bury a connection within the concrete.
 

LT_DIY

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appropriate couplings

Thanks Terry. You are not too far away and surely agree today is nice enough to be digging up the yard, but it wasn't on the plan when I woke up.

The pipe is a bit more exposed than the picture indicates. The cast iron looks to be in fair condition with a clean brake. So I think I can get a banded no-hub coupling to fit.

I have decided to use 4" ABS up though the cleanout so that I can use the banded coupling without reduction.

What is the right adapter to use if I have to dig up the line outside? I can see that there is no other hub connection for at least five feet outside. So basically I would be making the same spigot to spigot connection inside or outside. I just picked up a Fernco Pt. No. 3000-44 which has stainless steel clamps and band. Can I burry it?

I am under the UPC and have an open permit, so the inspector will have to sign off on the solution.


Thanks again.
 
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Redwood

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I really don't think you have enough to attach to there...
The banded fernco should be fine outside.

Install a cleanout outside while you have the line exposed...
 

Terry

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I don't see the side cut on the photo, but if you do have enough then measure the pipe first.

Most new cast iron no-hub is 4-3/8" OD
Some of the old stuff is 4-1/8" OD

If it's the smaller stuff, pick up a copper by cast coupling.

Your're not supposed to tell people when it's sunny here.
It always rains.
 

LT_DIY

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I'll be digging

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I took another look at the pipe edge and the coupling depth, and decided its too serrated to take any chances. I'll be digging this afternoon! The pipe looks to be about 30 inches underground at the foundation.

I like the advice of installing an outside cleanout. I just need to figure out how to do it.
 

Redwood

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Basically you would insert a wye and a street 45 into the line then continue it to the surface as shown in the picture below...

outsidecleanoutconfigurations.jpg
 
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LT_DIY

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The hole started small...

My excavation was going well. With the help of a friend we uncovered the cast iron in the yard near the foundation. A lot of the earth was washed away around the pipe and pretty wet. I cut through the cast iron pipe without much trouble. At first I had a hard time getting the cast iron in the foundation to budge, then with dismay noticed just nudging the street-end caused it to wiggle way too much. Turns out this piece terminated into an 1/8 bend made out of what looks like clay just a few more inches into the dirt. More digging revealed another broken fitting. The clay 1/8 bend was loose because the hub it sat in has about 1/3 of the circumference broken off.

This last hub is part of a Wye serving another house drain. On the good side, its very solid, and clean. I'm just wondering how to adapt to it? The pipe ID is 3 15/16", and the bell, of course, is broken. My thought is to go back to using 3" ABS and search for a donut that fits in the pipe ID. A couple more pictures attached.



On the good side, I now have room to add a cleanout! Thanks for the drawing Redwood. Not sure what the house trap is for.... but I don't have one now and this in not the only line leaving the house.

Thanks everyone!
 

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MACPLUMB

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Broken sewer pipe

What you need to do is keep following the broken pipe the snap
cutter will cut the clay pipe also get a clean cut on pipe do
not try to jury rig a bad connection, ! !
Then go to 4" abs back into the house you can not have 4" cast iron off your toilets and other drain fixtures inside then
reduce to 3" sewer,
the only way you can do that is go back and re-plumb all your house fixtures

by the way hows the weather their in bremerton, today, ? ?

I spent 3 years doing plumbing in kitsap county
 

Redwood

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That drawing was kind of a generic drawing that I made up showing various situations..

Your interest is only the cleanout!

As Jerry stated a drain line cannot go from 4" to 3" and back to 4".
The line may get bigger dia. but never smaller.

You will need to cut that broken hub off the vitrified clay pipe. A chain pipe snapper will do a great job of that! A K-12 saw with a diamond blade will also work.
 
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