Ian Gills and his Cadet 3

[Ian Gills]

If it was not for the space issue, and because you can obviously afford it, then the Drake would be a no-brainer.

But to save a few quid and with your space issue, the Cadet 3 Eudmin does appear tempting, I agree especially if you are fitting it yourself.

No worries with your flange. Mine is getting like that, and while this will be your last toilet on that, it should work fine. The wax ring will take up any slack. Although you will need to do something with those two other bolts.

Instead of using a long supply line, having looked at your set up I would solder an extra piece of copper down the wall; then solder a bronze 90 on to the pipe at the bottom with threads on the other side; then screw a short brass nipple into that (with teflon); and, then screw on to the nipple a new ball valve angle stop (with teflon). To all of which you would attach an ordinary 1 foot supply line. And I would secure the pipe to the wall using copper bell hangers. It would look neater and you would thank me later.

I am struggling to get over the shower head faucet and bucket sink but with what you have you could easily plumb a vanity in there if you are willing to extend those copper pipes down the wall by soldering them.

As an aside, I am a little worried that all of this strange plumbing in your picture looks so recent. A little extra effort and a few more bucks earlier on would have brought much better results.

At the moment a Toto might be too glamorous for this bathroom even if you did get it to fit.

Cadet 3s are less image conscious. They just get on with the job. American standard really.

[StrawberryBlonde]

I'm actually loving the creative plumbing for the sink in that room!

I can't wait to show it to my husband. He's wanting to "do something" with the laundry tub in my laundry room and that'd look pretty danged awesome. He'd have to use a large bucket though since he tends to want to wash some mighty big stuff in it...dog included. LOL

Maybe one of those old fashioned galvanized wash tubs? That'd be wide enough and deep enough to fit engine parts into it and still leave room to spare!

Wait wait, what am I thinking???!! I want a nice white vanity cupboard to match the rest of the laundry room cupboards!

Scratch that and please don't mention to him that I ever so much as thought of it, k?

SB

[Ian Gills]

Sorry I did not mean to cause offense with the bucket sink. Is it a Toto by any chance?

[Eudmin]

The weird plumbing is fairly recent, you're right. We bought the place from some artists, complete with walls painted with chalkboard paint, a cupboard made from a salvaged crisper door from an old fridge, a mailbox which is a model of the house in miniature, and a ceiling made of red corrugated plastic. At least they left all of the cans of different colored paint for us. There were 28 different colors in the house when I counted.

Maybe I'll hire some local graffiti artists to come decorate the Drake if I get it in and that will make it match the rest of the bathroom. I think a nice air-brushed praying saint on the wall behind it with some rays of light coming from the Drake tank would be tasteful.

Seriously, it bothers me that I'm making the place more "generic" even though it's getting more functional at the same time. I took out most of the corrugated red plastic and now took out the elevated tank toilet. Some of those features and the "weirdness" were what initially attracted us to this place, so I don't know if I'm doing the right thing or not.

Actually, maybe I'll tie the whole room together by carefully stenciling a Toto logo on the bucket sink. If I do that, I'll post pics for sure.

[Ian Gills]

It sounds like you have ordered a Toto toilet.

What will you do with the space issue?

[Eudmin]

I went to a local high-quality fixture store just to look today. I know it's not theoretically possible to get the Drake into my small space, but I just want to try it out.

They had boxes with Drakes just sitting there and they also had Cadet 3 bowls with the 12" tank, but no 10" tanks. I talked to them a little about it, we talked about my small space, I convinced them that I'm pretty careful and they sold me a Drake with the deal that they'll look it over carefully if I have to bring it back and get a Cadet 3 with the 10" tank. If it doesn't look brand new they'll charge me a 25% restocking, which I think is fair. I'm gonna dremel off those extra bolts, clean the heck out of my dirty flange and floor, lay down some clean rags, and try setting the Drake bowl on the bolts. If it fits I'll try setting the Drake tank on the bowl. If it almost sorta fits I'll think about it for a while. Maybe I'll take those bolts out of that old cast iron flange, cut notches 1/4in in front of where they are now and put them in again and see what the situation is now. Or drill into the concrete floor and screw some toilet bolts right into to the floor instead of the flange with the assumption that the outside of the Drake funnel is a bunch smaller than the inside of my 4" cast iron drain so I can sort of set it in the front of the flange rather than right in the middle.

Anyway, now that I have it home I can make much more detailed measurements than the spec drawings. I'm an experimentalist by training, ask lots of questions, do lots of reading, try things out, if they don't work try something else. It's a luxury that real plumbers don't have cause they're getting paid to do a job and don't have time to screw around. They'd put in a 10" rough-in toilet and move on to the next job. No one knows what I might do. I just might have the wall behind the toilet out in a few hours so I can screw smaller studs into the foundation wall to make a niche for the toilet. Or I might have unscrewed the Guinevere from upstairs (which has a 10" uni-fit on an 11" rough-in), lugged the beast downstairs, Tapconned it into the floor in the basement, and put the Drake upstairs where I'm more confident it will fit. Dunno.

Or maybe I'll see the thing in there and decide that I should just order the Cadet 3 with the 10" tank and have a much easier time getting a second toilet in the place.

[Eudmin]

Ian,

Sorry, I'm not getting a Cadet 3. The Drake went in just fine. 10-3/4" Drake install!! The tank screwed down on the bowl nice and snug and actually comes within a hair of touching the back wall. I may have a hopeless condensation problem if that occurs, but I'll deal with that if it happens.

It went in OK because the 4" cast iron flange was actually wider than the 3" exterior of the horn on the bottom of the Drake. I carefully dry fit it on the flange a few times and would offset it so the bolts were in the rear of the mounting slot. Gave me another 1/4" or so and it just worked out. I put two wax rings on the bottom of the Drake and had to shim up one side so I layed down a bead of grout that it can rest on to keep it level. The Drake's horn is level with the bottom of the toilet and the cast iron flange was level with the floor surface, so I just have a half inch or so of wax making the seal, but it should be fine, until it's not, at which time I'll be prepared to replace the flange, scrape off the grout and try to reseat it. 8) It filled last night, flushes fine, and looks good in the spot. My franken-supply hose is working out OK too. It looks really flashy going down the wall like it does.

Sorry you aren't getting another Cadet colleague.

Regards,

[adenwork2]

is it possible to put the 10" rough-in tank (4019.016) onto the round front bowl (3011.016) for a really tight space toilet or does that not work? They aren't sold together as a kit, that I can see. Normally the 10" tank seems to come with the elongated bowl so I think I'd have to buy them separately.

Yes.
Those are the exact part numbers for the AS Cadet 3 RF 10" number 2384010 in the catalog. Nominal dimensions 26-1/4" x17-1/4" x28-7/8". See the link for the spec sheet.
http://www.americanstandard-us.com/A...Sheet_1810.pdf

[Terry]

Ian,
I see you've upgraded to a quicker Mini.

Nice.

[Redwood]

Mmmmm that will probably be the worlds quickest Mini...
Turboed, intercooled, nitrous, 500 HP in a 1702 Lbs. carbon fiber body.
Yeeeee Haaaaaaa!http://paultan.org/archives/2006/04/...-fastest-mini/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mU7K27tikaQ



I think I liked the mini the Master Blasters fited up with 2 rocket motors and launched through the goal post uprights better...
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/37927/master_blasters/

[Ian Gills]

Yep. I put a Clorox bowl tab cleaner in my tank yesterday and thought I would symbolize the improvement to my Cadet 3 by a change to my avatar.

The parallels can be easily drawn. My Cadet 3 is ready for the big-time now. To put it simply, it goes like stink.

[Terry]

Is this the one that puts it down the overflow tube, or one that sits in the tank.
The ones in the tank will eat up rubber washers and flappers and will void warranties.

[Ian Gills]

Oops. I'd best take it out then. Thanks Terry.

[Reader Review]

Wow, I guess I got lucky. My Cadet 3 has been nothing but excellent.

Don't get me stated on Colonies though....especially former British ones...

[Reader Review]

Ian,

It took me two trips to HD to get a good bowl. The tank was flawless, and over one year later still has the original flapper (and the Korky replacements are readily available at our new Lowe's should I need one.

Dad and my next door neighbors continue to be satisfied with their Cadet 3's and one of my colleagues recently remodeled one of their two bathrooms, installed a Cadet 3 per my advice and had no quality issues with it (and I have seen it for myself and it is flawless). They love it, and so do their guests who have oood and ahhhed over it. They'll be installing one in their master bath as well.

achutch.. writing from near the spine of the Green Mountains in Vermont