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Thread: Anti-Scald Valve Requirement?

  1. #1
    DIY Member lahabra's Avatar
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    Smile Anti-Scald Valve Requirement?

    Do I need an anti-scald pressure balance valve?

    I am installing a tub/shower. I read in code check 3 that UPC requires it for showers but not for tubs.

  2. #2
    Plumber jimbo's Avatar
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    It is not required for just a tub, as long as you do not install any sort of hand held sprayer with it. The idea is that you can be in the shower, and a sudden change of temp can hit you without warning. You are a "
    captive audience" to that event! The tub, it fills over a long time, and even if you are in it, if there is a sudden change, you have time to reach up and turn off the hot or whatever.

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    DIY Member lahabra's Avatar
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    Why do the big box stores still sell the non protected valves with shower heads?
    Why dose Price Fister still make and sell it?

  4. #4
    Master Plumber Dunbar Plumbing's Avatar
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    That's soon to change here soon; they are outlawing these non-thermal balanced valves in the next few years.

    They'll still make 3 handle faucets, just pressure balanced.

    I switch those 3 hdle faucets to pressure balanced quite often.
    Read what the end of this sentence means.

  5. #5
    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking Rugged and pressure balanced valves

    With the two handle pressure balanced valves .....

    which ones do you find to be the best????

    I dont really care for the Deltas too much.....


    Here in beautiful Indy, we can still install old style

    2 handle tub and shower valves if it is a replacement only...


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    Plumber jimbo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lahabra View Post
    Why do the big box stores still sell the non protected valves with shower heads?
    Why dose Price Fister still make and sell it?
    Retail store are not bound by plumbing codes. To some extent, they will sell anything that someone will buy. You cannot rely on them for code information.

    In theory you can "replace" a 3 handle valve, and to some extent, there would be the judgement of an inspector as to how big the scope of a job can be and still not be called a "remode". I believe the demand for non-pressure balanced units is dropping, and at some point you will not be able to find them.

  7. #7
    DIY Senior Member construct30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by master plumber mark View Post
    With the two handle pressure balanced valves .....

    which ones do you find to be the best????

    I dont really care for the Deltas too much.....


    Here in beautiful Indy, we can still install old style

    2 handle tub and shower valves if it is a replacement only...
    We can also replace, but new tub only or tub and shower they want scald guard for both and pressure balance for showers. If we install a two or three handle on a tub it has to have a tempering valve adjusted to the proper temp on the hot water side.

    If you have young children or elderly living in a house I would always use the scald guard, good insurance. Many people try to adjust their water heaters low enough, not really legal, but then run into problems with enough hot water, the tempering valve works well.

  8. #8
    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    The new code, when it is adopted, WILL require thermostatic tub valves, and also thermostatic lavatory faucets in public rest rooms.

  9. #9
    DIY Senior Member construct30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hj View Post
    The new code, when it is adopted, WILL require thermostatic tub valves, and also thermostatic lavatory faucets in public rest rooms.
    The thermostatic control valves, while expensive and harder to repair, do work better than pressure balance valves. People complain about the pressure restriction of the pressure balance valves. You lose what a third or more of your pressure to allow for the balancing of the hot to cold. I for one like as much pressure as I can get when taking a shower after a long day.

    The high end shower valves for multiple heads almost always use them. They seem to be well engineered so far. Has anyone had issues with them? The pressure balance valves can be a problem.

  10. #10
    DIY Member lahabra's Avatar
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    I am installing a 42” x 60” tub/shower. It will take some time to fill. I don’t want to lose 30% water pressure. I refuse to install an unreliable tub diverter. And I want the ability to fill the tub with 100% hot water. I am thinking of installing separate valves, one dedicated to the tub filler, and the other for the 2 or 3 shower heads.

    Any suggestions on brands or setup?

  11. #11
    DIY Senior Member construct30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lahabra View Post
    I am installing a 42” x 60” tub/shower. It will take some time to fill. I don’t want to lose 30% water pressure. I refuse to install an unreliable tub diverter. And I want the ability to fill the tub with 100% hot water. I am thinking of installing separate valves, one dedicated to the tub filler, and the other for the 2 or 3 shower heads.

    Any suggestions on brands or setup?
    For multiple shower heads you need to buy a manufactured system and plumb it according to specs with the correct volumn of water or it won't work. Kohler makes a temp control valve that gives full pressure and works on multiple heads, big $$$.

  12. #12
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    Most of the brands make thermostatic controlled valves...I've got a Grohe tub/shower valve that I like. If you are going to go with multiple showerheads, carefully look at the flow rates for the valves you are interested in...match the load with the supply piping. An 'average' valve is good for about 6 gpm with a 1/2" supply, if your shower heads need more, you'll need a bigger supply line and valve. With a 3/4" valve, expect maybe in the 13gpm range, and with the right divertor, no need for separate valves...just get a good divertor.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  13. #13
    DIY Member lahabra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    and with the right divertor,
    what do you consider the right divertor?

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