My In-Laws Need Your Help

[SAS]

My wife's parents, who are in their 80's, live in an apartment building in Brooklyn, NY. There is a persistent urine smell around the toilet bowl in one of the bathrooms, even if the bowl and floor around it have been thoroughly cleaned. At one point there was some slight leakage around the bowl, but the super replaced the wax ring and that solved the obvious leakage. However, it still stinks in there!

We did get the super to change the wax ring a second time due to the smell, but it didn't solve the problem. My guess is that there is a small crack in the bowl near the wax ring and the new ring is keeping any water from seeping onto the floor, but some is leaking under the flooring causing the smell. Or could the flange have a crack in it?

The super is not going to do anything if he doesn't see water on the floor - he says it's just a matter of keeping the bathroom clean - so either I have to change the bowl myself or get a plumber to do it. I've installed toilets before; the only difference here is that it's a flushometer. Can I safely just disconnect the pipe that enters the bowl?

Or if I have to call a plumber, how much should I expect to spend?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Cass]

If urine is under the toilet no amount of cleaning is going to help.

You need to pull and clean under the toilet then reset it.

You could try and go to a pet store and get a product called Natures Miracle it is a liquid that will eliminate the uric acid that causes the odor, try pouring it on the floor so it flows under the toilet to where the urine is trapped.

[jimbo]

Don't take this personal: This question comes up ALL THE TIME on these forums. EVERY plumber has had this issue posed to him, more than once.. And the answer is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, someone is peeing on the floor. It is a simple as that. A leaking wax ring could cause sewer gas odors, or even water leaking out somewhere. But it is so dilute, you would not get a urine smell from it.

Just be gentle with the old boy. None of us are getting any younger! see if you can gently suggest that maybe the time has come to sit down to pee.

[grazzy]

i'm with jimbo, but the original poster did say they tried cleaning the floor around the toilet and the smell persists.

[SteveW]

The problem, like Cass said, is that in all likelihood there is urine under the toilet (snuck in under the base of the toilet in the front due to bad aiming).

Once the toilet is removed and the floor thoroughly cleaned under the toilet, caulk under the front half of the base of the toilet to prevent recurrence.

[SAS]

I understand that the problem might be my father-in-law's aim, but there are a couple of reasons I doubt it. First and foremost, there was a leak that required the super to replace the wax ring. Secondly, you can usually see evidence on the floor (it's white tile), particularly since my in-laws do their own housecleaning and neither their vision nor their dexterity enables perfect cleaning.

My hunch is still that there is a slight crack near the wax ring. That would explain the original leak. And a new wax ring might be positioned such that it is mostly sealing the leak. Does this sound plausible?

I guess I'll pull the toilet - unlesss someone tells me that there are any special issues dealing with a flushometer - and see what's going on underneath.

[Cass]

If te seat is old and has been there a long time there could be build up under where it attatches to the bowl.

[Verdeboy]

If the flange is too low, you can change the wax seal 100 times and it won't get a good seal. If you ever pull the toilet, see if the wax has been scrunched down. If not, you'll need to use 2 wax rings. As Cass suggested, make sure all the old wax is removed from under the toilet, if there is any.

Also, if water had been leaking for a long time, the subfloor may be rotted or just stinking from the smell.

If it's rotted, it will need to be fixed. If it is just wet, it will need to dry out. Once dry, you can spray on your deodorizer or even use some floor sealant if you have some exposed wood.

[Redwood]

Any urine by the time it is flushed out of the bowl with 1.6-5 gallons of water diluting it will not smell. Therefore a wax ring will do nothing! The problem is bad aim!

[frenchie]

A leaking ring won't cause unrine smell. It would cause sewer-gas smell.

It's that simple.



If the wood subfloor got soaked in urine at some previous time, you need to soak it in nature's miracle, or vinegar. Nothing else will remove the smell.

[Cass]

A bad wax ring can certainly cause a urine odor.

While flushing will dilute the urine, if they don't flush at night, like many people dont, and the concentration builds up and the water from peeing over flows the trap and leaks out past the wax ring, it will. It is more likely to happen with low flow toilets that have small water spots, they hold less water and the concentration can build up quickly.

[SAS]

Any urine by the time it is flushed out of the bowl with 1.6-5 gallons of water diluting it will not smell. Therefore a wax ring will do nothing! The problem is bad aim!

I'm not saying that bad aim might not be part of the problem, but it can't be the only answer. Here's why:

The definitely did have a noticeable leak, with water around the base of the bowl when you flushed. When that happened, they also had the urine smell. Now that the super has put in a new wax ring, they still get the smell but not the noticeable water around the base of the bowl. So if the original smell and leak were not because of a bad wax ring, what was the cause? A small crack at the base of the bowl? Something caused the leak and the smell, and I suspect it's still there, only to a smaller degreee so that you don't see the water but still have the smell.

[Dunbar Plumbing]

You need someone competent to pull the toilet, reset it properly with a new wax ring and caulk the base of the toilet to the floor, avoiding this issue with nastiness getting under the toilet.

That way when urine shows up around the base of the toilet, you'll know it's improper use of the toilet facility.

It's hard to get people to admit to misuse of their plumbing, with men it's bad aim or condoms, with women its female hygeine products or bf's condoms. Either way....they'll blatantly lie in front of you even though the prize is wrapped firmly around your cable, staring at you.

[Bob NH]

A simple solution since you are in an apartment might be to caulk ALL AROUND the toilet; then thoroughly clean the floor. Any odor should go wherever the drain pipe goes into some space under the floor.

A flushometer (I assume you mean the tankless quick-flushing devices) can be a little messy to deal with.

[Redwood]

I'll stand by my original post... Urine smell is bad aim... Always!
From the new revelation it sounds like there was a leaking wax ring and the only problem remaining is bad aim.