Brand New Well X Trol and Now What??

[billrok]

Gentlemen, after much lurking on this wonderful forum, I decided to replace the vintage 42 gal. galvanized tank with a brand new WX 302 by Well X Trol. New Sq.D. pressure switch set at 43/63. Tank at 40/41. Bought the house 3 years ago, previous owner said he replaced the pump 12 to 15 years ago. Franklin 1/2 hp. 3 wire, 3450, 230V. My old switch was set at 35/55 or so. No information on the well depth, etc. Installation was not a problem and the tank has worked flawlessly for the last few days (installed on 8-21) Today the daughters were doing dishes and pressure dropped to 15. Switch working fine. Power on both sides of switch. While watching the gage pump started working again and pressure jumped to 50, pump continued til cut off point. Works great at normal cut in and cut out then while pump is running, it mystically stops. I shut off power at service switch for a few minutes and when switched back on, it runs and cycles fine. Pump cycle time is just at two minutes to cut off. Am I on the verge of losing this pump? Pure coincidence on the timing or is it a result of the slightly higher cut off point? Gentlemen, with four daughters and a wife, I need your help pretty quick!! Thanks.

[Bob NH]

I would start by checking the pressure gauges.

Pressure dropping to 15 and then jumping to 50 psi when the pump starts sounds like too much air on the air side of the bladder.

Check the air-side presssure when the pump shuts off. It should be exactly the same as the water-side gauge. If it is not then the gauges are not matched.

With the power to the switch off, slowly discharge all water from the tank while watching the water gauge. The pressure switch should actuate to try to start the pump 2-3 psi before the tank is empty.

The pressure on the water gauge just before it drops quickly is the precharge air pressure in the tank.

Check the air pressure again when the switch acutates to start the pump at the low end. It should be the same as the water gauge pressure.

After you get the air pressure and the tank pressure matched on your measuring devices, and are sure that the gauges are giving you the correct readings; try the cycle again and see if you have solved the problem.

[billrok]

Bob NH, thanks for the quick response. The water gauge is a new 4" Viking and I'm using a precision analog tire pressure gauge with rotary dial. Air side is just at or maybe a pound or two below cut in pressure consistently. What's happening is sometime after the pump cuts in it will simply stop. I can no longer hear the water feeding into the tank. Nothing. Power is there on both sides of the pressure switch. It's random at this point but I'm thinking I'm about to lose this pump. If I shut the power off at the service switch for a few minutes, I can get the pump to run again. By that time the pressure is down to whatever if the daughters were running more water. It will again run to cut off with no issues for several cycles but I'm still puzzled by the pumps actions.

[Bob NH]

Do you have any other control element in the system, such as a Pumptec which is designed to protect the pump against running out of water?

The symptom of running out of water and being able to restart the pump later may reflect an overload on the pump (pump failure possible, such as causes dragging in the internals of the pump) or low water at the pump.

If you have or can get a clamp-on ammeter you can measure the current when the pump is running and compare it to the correct current for the motor. Higher than normal current suggests dragging or friction in the pump. Lower than normal current suggests low water because the characteristic of such pumps is that no water at the suction, or throttling with a valve, causes less current.

High current could also be caused by a leak in the up-pipe that will cause very high flow. When a pump is operating against low pressure it will pull too much current and could overheat. Some of the 2-wire pumps contain overlaod protectors that open the circuit when they get too hot, and close automatically when they cool off.

If the overload is open, then you should be able to measure an open circuit (infinite resistance) in the pump power circuit. You would make that measurement with the power off.

[Raucina]

possibly a temperature switch in the motor cutting out on overheat. Clamp on an ammeter to the pump wires and watch if the amp draw goes to zero while running.

[billrok]

My trusty Fluke reads 5.5/5.6A on one leg and 6.2/6.2 on the other leg while pump is running. Cut in and cut out pressures remain unchanged. Unfortunately the symptoms haven't reproduced themselves while I'm watching just as of yet. Lack of water in the well is not a factor around here. Tons of rain and all my neighbors have zero issues with volume. If I show zero amps and the pump still has power to it, am I to assume that it's not spinning and locked up or about to lock up?? Also: What would you expect to pay for just the replacement of such a pump? Thanks.

[Rancher]

If I show zero amps and the pump still has power to it, am I to assume that it's not spinning and locked up or about to lock up?? Also: What would you expect to pay for just the replacement of such a pump?

If you see zero amps it means the wire to the pump is open, you say 3-wire pump, that means you have a pump controller box, or are you counting the green wire ground? I would replace the pump myself, pump would run $200-$300, much less than 4 angry daughters and a wife. But I'm not sure that's your problem. If the contacts in the pressure switch are operating at the correct pressures, then the high temp cutout in the pump is causing the pump to stop, which means new pump...

Rancher

[Raucina]

the high temp cut out will actuate if the pump is being used beyond its curve or specs, not only if it is getting old or on low voltage.

[speedbump]

The age of the pump alone tells me it's time for a change. We all know that daughters use far more water than wives, sons or anyone else. This is probably why the overload protector is tripping. The pump is on it's way out. If your in a hurry to get a new one you can shop here:
Submersible Pumps

bob...