Plumbing hasn't been used in years
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CHH
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The max temperature dependent change is about 2 psi. It's a 20 psi test:
4. Subsection 406.4.1 is replaced with the following:
Threaded gas piping shall be tested at 20 psi for a duration of 24 hours. Welded or medium pressure gas piping shall be tested at 60 psi for 24 hours.
4. Subsection 406.4.1 is replaced with the following:
Threaded gas piping shall be tested at 20 psi for a duration of 24 hours. Welded or medium pressure gas piping shall be tested at 60 psi for 24 hours.
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GrumpyPlumber
Licensed Grump
CHH said:
You'll chuckle.
Here we test water at 125 psi or we can just go live.
On gas, we test at 3psi for (get this) a minimum of ten minutes with a gauge that reads a range of 10 psi for detail.
I always did find that odd...most plumbers here do the 24 hour test for their own conscience.
As for the schraders, seldom a problem even on water tests.
Having schraders on test gauges makes it easier to grab any old bike pump when you don't have a compressor handy.
SouthernNaturelover
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winslow said:
That's kinda what I envisioned. I would definitely have to hire a plumber to work on the drains since I wouldn't even attempt to bust up a slab.
I should have stated from the beginning that I will be gutting the interior. All of the sheetrock walls and ceilings will be removed and replaced. The exterior walls are block, but the inner walls are typical 2x4 studs. That's why I said I would just tear out the existing galvanized piping. But, I would need to run the new PVC piping through the attic. My main problem will be where the water pipe comes out of the slab, I will need to convert it over to PVC.
Leejosepho
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southernnaturelover said:
Only for cold water. Hot water needs CPVC.
CHH
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I'm sure some folks around here use Schraders. I don't personally see very many tests.
Isn't the 10 minute, low pressure test in the National Fuel Gas code? I don't know why the locals here think they know better. I'd prefer an accurate low pressure test over a test that is much higher than working pressure and is suject to some uncertainty as Cass pointed out.
In my line of work we do both low and high pressure tests because seals behave differently under different conditions. Of course low pressure is 250 and high is whatever max test rating is for a particular installation, usually 5,000 psi but sometimes 10,000. Those tests are always "stand way back" events.
Isn't the 10 minute, low pressure test in the National Fuel Gas code? I don't know why the locals here think they know better. I'd prefer an accurate low pressure test over a test that is much higher than working pressure and is suject to some uncertainty as Cass pointed out.
In my line of work we do both low and high pressure tests because seals behave differently under different conditions. Of course low pressure is 250 and high is whatever max test rating is for a particular installation, usually 5,000 psi but sometimes 10,000. Those tests are always "stand way back" events.
SouthernNaturelover
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leejosepho said:
Would it be best to use CPVC for hot and cold? Even the cold water pipes will get hot occasionally in the attic.
Markts30
Commercial Plumber
Just thinking about using a bike pump for last week's test makes my shoulders ache...GrumpyPlumber said:
360' of 4" Sch40 welded gas line to pump up - to 100lbs for our test (60 for inspector at "final" time) - It would have taken me most of the week LOL
We use bike pumps for inflating test balls and that is it...
We use compressors to test larger water mains (over 2-1/2") with air (60lbs) before water testing for our own peace of mind (and for fixing any leaks that might have occurred) and we test all gas installs with air as well.
Leejosepho
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southernnaturelover said:
First please keep in mind I am not a professional plumber ...
In my own house, I used PVC for everything between the well and the water softener as well as to supply the outside spigots with untreated water ... and I am still in the process of using CPVC for everything else ... and I would suspect some attic areas can at times be too hot for regular PVC, but I do not know that for sure.
GrumpyPlumber
Licensed Grump
markts30 said:
We're very manly 'round these parts when it comes to 4" gas mains and bike pumps.
I've done commercial ...and NO we didn't use a bike pump.
Bike pumps are good for testing gas...NOT humongo industrial complexes with 6" mains.
And I more often use them for test balls in dandy CO's than anything else.
I'm talking a standard single family with a 1" or 3/4" main.
As for testing water lines...use a compressor or simply fill and keep fingers crossed.
GrumpyPlumber
Licensed Grump
CHH said:
OK, you just had to know I was going to ask.
WHAT line of work are you in??
Leejosepho
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Check his initial posts -- he is the oil-field guy.
GrumpyPlumber
Licensed Grump
leejosepho said:
You stole his limelight.
was hoping he'd elaborate...industrial stuff is very interesting.
I've worked a good deal of commercial, chemical plants, concrete plants with steam lines and automated solenoids for water injection and machinery that is run all by computer.
I'm one of those dorks who'll sit and watch the science channel show on industrial machinery, or how tin cans are made.
Leejosepho
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GrumpyPlumber said:
Oops, please pardon!
GrumpyPlumber said:
Same here.
Did you see the one on toothpicks?
GrumpyPlumber
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leejosepho said:
I liked the one on toilets, surprized they aren't more automated, even the coating is sprayed by hand.
CHH
New Member
Ok, I'll elaborate a little bit.
The oilpatch is a typical business, that is they don't do anything unless they have to and the profit margin determines success or failure.
It's been a long road but we have learned to protect what we must and accept the costs of failure as part of the business.
From a mechanical standpoint, drilling a well is merely boring a hole through rock. Use weight and some form of chisel point and you will break the rock. Of course we must figure out how to remove the broken rock from the cutting face and deal with any fluids in the rock. Sometimes we can't quite figure out how to deal with fluids in the rock and we end up with problems at the surface. For those occasions, we have back-up equipment that we have to be sure works. The equipment is called blow-out prevention equipment (BOPE) which is basically a large valve designed to work under a variety of conditions. We regularly test and rebuild these valves as part of normal operations. The testing and rebuilding of BOPE's is an industry all it's own. Since the cost of failure is high, the cost for operation is quite high. It's all part of the industry. I can go into nauseating detail here about material specs and test procedures. I'd rather not. I will say that machining tolerances are rather tight, pressure tests are downright scary, and the cost of failure includes injury and death. That's just the drilling side of the business. It's not something to just jump into because the salaries look good.
What else to say? Making sure folks have plenty of natural gas and fuel oil is a difficult challenge. The rewards are high but the risks are equally high.
The oilpatch is a typical business, that is they don't do anything unless they have to and the profit margin determines success or failure.
It's been a long road but we have learned to protect what we must and accept the costs of failure as part of the business.
From a mechanical standpoint, drilling a well is merely boring a hole through rock. Use weight and some form of chisel point and you will break the rock. Of course we must figure out how to remove the broken rock from the cutting face and deal with any fluids in the rock. Sometimes we can't quite figure out how to deal with fluids in the rock and we end up with problems at the surface. For those occasions, we have back-up equipment that we have to be sure works. The equipment is called blow-out prevention equipment (BOPE) which is basically a large valve designed to work under a variety of conditions. We regularly test and rebuild these valves as part of normal operations. The testing and rebuilding of BOPE's is an industry all it's own. Since the cost of failure is high, the cost for operation is quite high. It's all part of the industry. I can go into nauseating detail here about material specs and test procedures. I'd rather not. I will say that machining tolerances are rather tight, pressure tests are downright scary, and the cost of failure includes injury and death. That's just the drilling side of the business. It's not something to just jump into because the salaries look good.
What else to say? Making sure folks have plenty of natural gas and fuel oil is a difficult challenge. The rewards are high but the risks are equally high.
GrumpyPlumber
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Joe, that beats toothpics anyday.
Leejosepho
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CHH said:
A friend of mine in Texas is a "bit tipper", building up the tips of the bits used to bore holes in rock. He spends the day sitting and leaning over a tub of water that keeps the overall assembly cool while he uses a torch to add the filler rod at the contact points.
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