Major water issues

I need major help. We bought a home two years ago with known low water volume issues. However, the homeowner (also the builder) advised they had only run out of water twice – once when filling the wood burner outdoor heating unit and all the associated piping and once when trying to get the yard started. He even stated they have 13 people staying in the house at once with all three showers going and never ran out of water. He and the pump guy also advised that we had plenty of reserves in a 200' well and with the large pressure tank. Phooey!

We have never had decent water from day one but it has become much worse as time has progressed. I am told we have a 200’ plus deep well. The driller told me he hit a lot of water at 40’ but it was soft shale and had to go deeper. The well ended up with .75 gallon per hour (yes, per hour) according to all records. Now you will know why we cannot survive like this.

The well has been hydro-fractured once but only partially for reasons related to cost (supposedly). When we first started having troubles about three months into the house, we would simply run out of water completely. After about a year, it completely stopped producing and were told we needed a new pump and pressure tank. I could buy this as a tree was struck by lightening close by and theoretically could have fried the pump. After this $1200 fix we still ran out of water constantly and now it required us to shut off the pump for a period of 30 minutes to two hours to get it going again. This spring and summer, we are experiencing a new set of problems - very low water pressure constantly but not running out of water completely. The water usually starts out with a lot of pressure but slows substantially about one to two gallons into it. The pressure then diminishes further as you use the water.

Something else we have noticed is that our pump pressure is much reduced since the installation of the new tank (which is smaller than the old one). Often (but not always) the low water pressure in the house is NOT associated with lower tank pressure. We also notice that the higher in the house we go, the lower the water pressure.

So the question now is what to do? We must do something! Do we try to refract and go for broke? I have talked to other well guys and they won't even touch the well because of the partial refract thinking it has partially collapsed or is in danger of collapsing. If we drill a new well how do we know this is not going to be a bust too? Is there a chance there is a clog somewhere? What about that whole house filter before the pump?? Should we try to replace it? Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

As far as house pressure they may have installed a different pressure switch. In general they are 20/40 or 30/50. It (the switch) may not be set right also or the tank air pressure may not be set right. I would call the installer back to go over the work done and check everything out.


The other problems can be addressed better by the well guys who will be along at some point

.75 gallons per minute is 1080 gallons per day, we can make that work .75 gallons per hour is only 18 gallons per day, that will never work. Double check that because I don't even know how you would measure an amount as low as .75 GPH. If that is correct, you are going to need a new well or some other way to get water. No guarantees when drilling wells, unless you are on better terms with the creator herself than anybody else I know. A good driller may can give you some idea but, you have to drill a hole in the ground to see how much water will come out.

Get rid of the filter or at least take out the cartridge. I would pump straight out of the well itself to make sure of the well and pump production.

Thanks for your responses. I realize we are talking 18 gallons a day - my son who is on a submarine said he is alotted more water per day than that! When I saw it on the paperwork from the original well drilling I asked about it because I thought it was a mistake. The guy remembered it right away and said it was correct. When we had it tested it measured out again at .75 gallon per hour (I don't know how he did it but I know he sat there for over an hour measuring it). In reality, I think we might get a little more than that but certainly no where near 1000 gallons a day. I cannot even run my washing machine - even though it is one of the frontloaders that takes very little water, it doesn't sense enough water and constantly gives an error message.

Anything I should be aware of before I open up that filter to remove the cartridge?

As far as the pressure switch - can someone explain what the 20/40 and 30/50 means? I presume the 40 and 50 are the upper limits (our old tank gauge - when we had water - went to 50 but this one only goes to 40) but what is the 20 and 30? I can call out the pump man that installed the pump and tank but I am in a bad spot here because of the known water deficiency - he wants to blame that instead of looking at the equipment!

20/40 means the switch turns on the pump when you are using water and the pressure drops below 30# it will then run until the pressuer reaches 50# then shut off.

I am guessing that with .75 gallons /hr. flow rate you will burn out the pump sooner than expected because it will run to long trying to fill the tank.

20/40 means on at 20 and off at 40. Not much you can do to the equipment if you really only have 3/4 gallon per hour.

around here they would just call that a dry hole and move over to a new spot. Since you have the paperwork revealing the non existence of water, you probably have no recourse against the builders "optimism" . If its a vacation home and you have a big cistern to store water in, and you pump it full time at .75 gallon per hour [!] you might have enough for a weeks vacation every other week. Maybe your neighbor will sell you water.

I agree - it is a dry hole!

This is not a vacation home - this is our residence! Our neighbors are at least a half mile away so that is not an option either. I guess I need to get a well driller out here.

What about hydrofracturing? Is it worth throwing $1200 at that or should I just go straight to drilling?

jsmith7535 said:

Anything I should be aware of before I open up that filter to remove the cartridge?

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Your question makes it sound like that has not been done in quite a while ...

If you do not have the correct wrench for the filter housing, you might not even be able to get it off. The inside is possibly going to look like a science project, and you will need some food-grade lubricant for the o-ring after you have everything cleaned -- have a bucket of water handy -- and ready to close up once again.

Having a filter BEFORE the pump says you have a jet pump (above ground) instead of a submersible pump in the well. The jet could be blocked but more likely is the filter. You shouldn't have a filter before a jet pump; either a deep well, two line or a shallow well single line (to/from the well) jet pump. Remove the filter or at least the cartridge. You can't suck/push water through a blocked filter.

The jet is in the wet end of the jet pump, if it is blocked you won't get much to any water through the pump. Same for a blocked or partially closed valve after the pump.

I think the water you are getting is more like condensation dripping down the sidewalls!

You can roll the dice on fracturing, but I think what you need is the guy that drilled your area for 25 years, no matter what his per foot cost is. And get a good witch with a stick to walk the area for a bottle of wine too.

Talk to that neighbor and find out how he got water and by whom.

Around here, moving the hole 20 feet sometimes gives a gusher, and often they drill down the same hole deeper - that would be my first choice.

I found the guy who has drilled the area for 25 years - he is the guy who did the well next door (but then the guy who drilled this well has been doing it for a long time too - I would say they are about half and half around here). Anyway, he won't touch the current well but is willing to start from scratch - can't say that I blame him considering the value of the equipment he is putting on the line.

I am definitely going to find a witch (even if I have to go behind my husband's back who doesn't believe in them). I would rather hire a witch and fail than to not hire one and fail!

As far as the filter, it is not before the pump, it is before the pressure tank. I am certain it is a submersible as I have the old one sitting in my garage in the box the new one came in.

And as far as replacing the cartridge in the filter - we haven't touched it since we moved in two years ago. Who knows, maybe that is the secret behind the diminishing water but you would think someone would have mentioned it to us before now. The only good advice I have received from anyone that is not related to a new well, pump, or tank is to shut off the water softener. At this point it would not even be a question but when this first started we could get away with it unless we had unusual demand on our water (like company).

My husband thinks there is a problem somewhere in the plumbing that is causing the diminishing water supply. I can't say if he is right or wrong. He wants me to call a plumber and not mention the well issues and see if we can get someone to really look at the big picture and decide if there is another solution. Quite honestly, if the water would return to the way it was when we first moved in, we could get along okay.

If you have a submersible pump, that filter before the pressure tank is a serious problem and you really should remove the filter before your pump blows itself off the drop pipe in the well, or blows the plumbing down the well.

That is the cause of your no water and low pressure problems. It may have caused other problems, like high electric bills, leaks in the well plumbing etc..

You should never have anything that can block up between a submersible pump and the pressure switch controlling it. As to no one mentioning it, it is very abnormal, so no one would think to ask about a filter before a pressure tank. Anyway, you now know to remove.

2 years on a filter? Hopefully it has blown out and water is passing through. But if not, you have a huge dirty cork stuck in your pipes - get it out. Maybe you do not need a new well after all.

Yes, just pull the filter out of the housing and replace the housing and see what happens. Don't even bother replacing the filter right now.

Since my husband is unhandy and I have so much arthritis in my hands, I am calling a plumber today and asking him to do something about the filter. I am hoping this is the magic bullet!

Thanks for all your posts!

jsmith7535 said:

I am definitely going to find a witch (even if I have to go behind my husband's back who doesn't believe in them). I would rather hire a witch and fail than to not hire one and fail!

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Water Witch's are a joke, that said, I hired two before drilling my well, I used the one that was the most entertaining...

Rancher

Rancher and I agree on at least one thing. Dousers are a joke.

bob...

speedbump said:

Rancher and I agree on at least one thing. Dousers are a joke.

Click to expand...

My first douser had done all the work before I got to the property, he drew a map of the area and on the hood of his truck, using a pendulum moved it across the map and by the number of swings... or something he drew out the underground streams with depth and GPM... that alone was worth the $50. The second one, a woman, cut a branch out of a mesquite tree, said it had to be a fruit bearing tree, and the beans the mesquite produce qualified it as a fruit bearing tree... then asked me where I wanted to put my septic field, I responded tell me where the water is, I'll put the septic somewhere else...

Needless to say I selected the first douser's result, I hit more than 18 GPM at 100' feet (it was a wet year) I get a lot less than that now but it still produces, even with my kludged up storage tank and duplexed pump system.

Rancher

Years ago there was an area (which was rare) where the vein just wasn't available in certain spots. My day was called out on a job where the well had to be replaced. My day knowing the area very well said he would move over just a few feet and drill another well.

The homeowner wouldn't hear of it. What could this stupid Well Driller know? He called in his favorite Douser who moved the location to the opposite side of the yard. About 6 weeks later (my Dad had a lot more patience then I) he moved back to the old location and had a well working in a few days.

bob...