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Thread: Kitchen Sink Venting

  1. #1
    DIY Junior Member massillonmarine's Avatar
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    Default Kitchen Sink Venting

    I bought my house from an auction. This is my first home and I'm only somewhat handy. A guy I went to school with offered to do all my work. Long story short, he quit halfway through. My kitchen sink had no drainage issues whatsoever before he installed the new sink (deeper tubs) and garbage disposal. My sink has drainage issues. It fills up on one side and eventually the other and then they both rise together. He exclaims that all I need to do is wire the disposal and run it....that it would fix all my problems. Well, I wired the disposal and ran it (with water, without water, turning it on and off to create some air movement in the water) and nothing worked. It used to take an hour or so to drain, now it's taking hours to drain. I don't know if all I need is an under-sink vent or there is something wrong with the existing vent (IF THERE IS EVEN ONE!) I don't know cause like I said, I bought this at auction. I could not get any info on the house from the auctioneer, title company, or the city. Posted below is a pic, sorry it's not more well lit. My camera made it too bright with flash and not enough without. Anyway....have at it...I would appreciate some help.


  2. #2
    In the Trades kordts's Avatar
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    Number 1: get rid of the trap on the right. I would install a cleanout and rod it out. It might need a vent also.

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    DIY Junior Member massillonmarine's Avatar
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    Maybe I should have stated this in my original post. Could all help be broken down into Barney-style answers. I'm not hip with the plumbers lingo. I do know what a trap is though.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    Default trap

    The trap you do not need is the upside down "P" shaped thing next to the disposer. That by itself will not cause your problem. You probably have a plugged drain somewhere in the building, not necessarily the sink drain, given your piping arrangement, which is preventing the drainage. A plumber should be able to determine where the problem is and correct it.

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    DIY scratch-pad engineer leejosepho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by massillonmarine
    My kitchen sink had no drainage issues whatsoever before he installed the new sink (deeper tubs) and garbage disposal. My sink has drainage issues. It fills up on one side and eventually the other and then they both rise together.
    Like has been said, there is nothing in that sink's plumbing that would cause that kind of problem. One side of the sink fills the other simply because the water in neither has any place to go, and that means the drain line is clogged somewhere. With the sink temporarily disconnected, you might be able to use the pressure from a garden hose to blow down into that drain line and dislodge the clog.

    Also, the water supply lines there both look to me like regular PVC, and if so, that is a problem since CPVC should have been used.

  6. #6
    Writing, constructionDIY Member Yersmay's Avatar
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    I'm by no means a pro but I'm posting because I'm curious. Isn't this a good example of an 'S' trap? And isn't that against the rules? If there is no vent to this set up, wouldn't that in itself explain the drainage problem?

  7. #7
    DIY Junior Member massillonmarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leejosepho
    Also, the water supply lines there both look to me like regular PVC, and if so, that is a problem since CPVC should have been used.
    It is PVC, this is what it says on the it.......3/4" Silver-Line PVC-1120 SCH. 40 PR.480 PSI @ 73degrees F ASTM D-1785 (NSF-pw)] 2B SL-M NC 01/17/07

    We went through a ton of leaking/bursting pipes because he bought the wrong glue. Eventually we got the right glue, but he didn't cure the glue long enough which lead to more leaking/bursting pipes. I paid a lot of money to keep redoing these. Currently I have a a super small bubble up leak that has been pretty steady for over a month in the same spot. I'm just waiting until it pops apart so I can re glue it instead of be having to redo it (it's right at a "t" and would be a lot of work to redo). I do have alot of pressure issues with this. I think I have some air in the line, but I'm not sure how to get it out. I have the water shutoff to the tub upstairs cause it just leaks water right out of the tub faucet if I don't. The toilet and sink have water though. I'm so hard up on money that I am trying to avoid a plumber. My old landlord is supposed to come over and do my work for cheap, but he's so busy with his new truck driving job.

    Anywho.....one project at a time. I want to get this sink taken care of, then I'll move on to the water issues. I think I am going to take the drain apart and flush it and possibly get a snake for it. Thanks for the advice, keep it coming. Also, if any of you have the ability to draw on my pic that would be nice. I've seen it done on other posts. What would you use to make this change to the downward P trap?

  8. #8
    DIY scratch-pad engineer leejosepho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by massillonmarine
    ... if any of you have the ability to draw on my pic that would be nice. I've seen it done on other posts. What would you use to make this change to the downward P trap?
    I do not know the issue with the "S" trap, if that is what this is, but I cannot imagine this not working properly:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  9. #9
    Plumber Cass's Avatar
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    Your drain issues are nothing compaired to the problems you could face with a ruptured water line. I would suggest you turn off the water every time you leave the house until it is fixed.

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    Homeowner geniescience's Avatar
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    yes it is an S trap. Problems do arise with S traps: they cannot guarantee to hold the seal against sewer gases. The fact that professional plumbers haven't commented on it yet doesn't mean it is an OK installation. The first really big problem was the other P trap, in series with this S trap.

    Some recent threads here have dealt with inserting an AAV and a small stub of pipe to make it into a P trap; please note that although AAV's solve that one big problem with S traps but they (AAV's) are not bulletproof themselves, for a few reasons.

    david

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    DIY scratch-pad engineer leejosepho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geniescience
    Problems do arise with S traps: they cannot guarantee to hold the seal against sewer gases.
    Can you explain? In an S-trap, more water than found in a P-trap would have to be moved in order for anything else to get through.

  12. #12
    Homeowner geniescience's Avatar
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    no, sorry. I'm at the limit of my knowledge and i don't want to risk adding more words than may be accurate. I've never had to deal with S traps in my experience, and whatever I could say would essentially be hearsay rehashed and reworded, or internet based learning reworded. I wouldn't want to pollute this thread with posts that say very little. The thread originator may need to know that it's an S trap, and what to do about, so it could be relevant to add more information about it, so don't think I'm against adding information here. Search in this site and elsewhere on the internet and let us know what you learn too. There must be an easy way to explain it to your satisfaction and everyone's.

    david

  13. #13
    In the Trades kordts's Avatar
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    S-traps aren't vented. That's why they are illegal. They siphon out too easily. Drains that are double trapped also drain slow. You only need one trap, but it should be vented. After that is done, any other drainage issues can be addressed.

  14. #14
    Commercial Plumber markts30's Avatar
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    Take the vertical drain pipe coming from the floor and extend it then glue on a wye for a cleanout and above that a san-t... Above the san tee put an AAV (ie a Studor-Vent)...
    From the san-t branch, pipe to one PTrap and then use a continuous waste kit to tie the sink and disposer into one line....

  15. #15
    DIY Junior Member massillonmarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markts30
    Take the vertical drain pipe coming from the floor and extend it then glue on a wye for a cleanout and above that a san-t... Above the san tee put an AAV (ie a Studor-Vent)...
    From the san-t branch, pipe to one PTrap and then use a continuous waste kit to tie the sink and disposer into one line....

    Funny that you said that while I was gone at the store. I pretty much surmised on my own that I needed that based on other threads and pics of other installs. I'll let you all know how that goes and I'll post an updated pic when it's all done. I guess I have to wait 24 hrs for the All-purpose pvc glue to cure, right?

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