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Thread: American Standard Cadet 3 Three Toilet consumer product review

  1. #331
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    To test if the bowl water height is proper, take a bucket of water and after first noting the current level in there, slowly pour water in. To work properly, the water height in the bowl should be at the max level. If it gets higher and stays there after pouring water into the bowl (any excess will slowly drain out on its own), then you need to check the tube that going into the overflow pipe. If it isn't clipped on or is misaligned, or pushed down into the tube, it won't work right. If the water level drops to the original height, then that's as high as it gets on that bowl, nothing you can do about it. If it does go higher and stays there, then you need to investigate why it's not filling. If the water height in the tank is proper and the overflow bowl fill tube is oriented properly, then the fill valve is either the wrong one for your toilet, or needs to be replaced.

    The hissing you noticed could have been from some debris that got caught in the seal. Subsequent flushes washed it away.
    Jim DeBruycker
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    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  2. #332
    DIY Junior Member Steve603's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by achutch View Post
    Below is part of my post dated 04-12-2008 that refers to the defective Cadet 3 bowls. Today I found a defect in "Bowl #4" that goes beyond cosmetic which I consider serious.

    We have been noticing a foul odor like stale urine that seems to be coming from inside the toilet bowl (not on the floor or anywhere else -- both of us have good noses). Until now, I have NEVER had a toilet that smells. This morning, after I noticed that the smell had gotten worse, I took a hand mirror and looked underneath the rim. See attached photos of the separation of the glaze between the rim and the bowl. I believe that this may be where the odor is coming from.

    [/I]
    Thank You!

    That is an amazing photo! The next time I buy a toilet a hand mirror and level will be coming with me! Sure, splatters leave an extremely fertile ground for stench--what a horrendous (and increasing, I fear) example of total lack of QA.

  3. #333
    DIY Senior Member achutch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve603 View Post
    Thank You!

    That is an amazing photo! The next time I buy a toilet a hand mirror and level will be coming with me! Sure, splatters leave an extremely fertile ground for stench--what a horrendous (and increasing, I fear) example of total lack of QA.
    Thank you, Steve603! I hope my experience and photos, plus the experiences of others who wasted time and money on a product that should have never made to the shelves, will help others to not make the same mistake.

    As you read, I wasn't even willing to give American Standard a second chance even if I bought a Grade A Cadet 3 as shown at a plumbing supply house. If anyone asks me where and what to buy for a toilet, I will tell them NOT to buy one at a box store, and then I will point them toward Toto and to the plumbing supply house where I bought my two Drakes.

    achutch

  4. #334
    DIY Junior Member gramps's Avatar
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    As you read, I wasn't even willing to give American Standard a second chance even if I bought a Grade A Cadet 3 as shown at a plumbing supply house.
    .

    How does that work? do they take the rejects with minor or major defects and give them to the big box stores?

  5. #335
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    It has been said, but I cannot confirm, that to get the lower price, the big box stores tell the manufacturer to not perform a final inspection (that is done for those that are sold through plumbing supply houses). Thus, it may come off the same production line, could be perfect, but also could be a reject if it were to go through that final inspection. So, you buy it, you are the final inspector. Most people don't know what to look for, and may not realize that it isn't working as it should. Course, it could be fine.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  6. #336
    DIY Junior Member skap's Avatar
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    I recently purchased 2 Cadet 3 toilets although they are now called cadet 3 Savers. I had read about the splashing problem and I too see a problem with splashing. After spending days looking over the toilet I think this may be just the design of the low water flow toilet. These toilets have the 3" flush valve(?) and I think that makes them more powerful. Combine that with a very low amount of water and I think this may be the cause of the splash. I have noticed that if you hold down the handle for about a second more then the entire tank will empty and there will be no splash. Overall I am happy with this toilet and we do not mind adjusting to holding the handle down for a second more or so when needed. I have a relative who bought 3 low water flow toilets and saw a significant decrease in his water bill.
    Last edited by Terry; 07-09-2011 at 07:17 PM.

  7. #337
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    Holding the handle down defeats the whole water saving premise...today's low flow toilets use the water height to provide the push and are not designed to use the whole tank like the old ones did. Holding it down can use as much as twice the water, and not save much, depending on the age of the one replaced. Good ones do not splash...
    Last edited by Terry; 07-09-2011 at 07:16 PM.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  8. #338
    DIY Junior Member garyw5687's Avatar
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    Default Washlet clarification with American Standard Cadet 3 Please

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomw View Post
    I bought three Cadet 3 one piece, ADA height, elongated toilets recently. All three of them were perfect - no flaws. They were very easy to install and they sit perfectly flat and level. The flushing performance is phenomenal. They are MAP rated at 1000. The bowl wash is very effective and the water spot is relatively large for a 1.28 gal flush toilet. The everclean glaze that they use seems stays very clean - the water still beads on it after over 2 months. I have not had to use a toilet brush so far.

    The flapper is different than the one that is shown in previous posts. Maybe they improved it? I don't know, but I have had no issues so far.

    All in all - I am very happy with my purchase. The one thing I don't like is that the Toto S300 Washlet seat I purchased will not mount on the one-piece Cadet 3 toilet. This is because there is a lip that rises up to the tank from the bowl. This is supposed to make the toilet easier to clean, but it also prevents me from installing the washlet.

    I found that the washlet will fit on a Champion 4, but this meant I had to swap toilets from the guest bath to the master bath. What a pain! The washlet works perfectly on the Champion 4 and is highly recommended. It was very easy to install - less than 1/2 hour. Now, not only am I using a lot less water, but I am also using a lot less TP. A good combination for a septic system.
    I have an American Standard Cadet 3 two piece, ADA height, elongated toilet (model 3016.016.222) and I'm not sure from your above post if a Toto washlet, such as the S300, will or will not work with my toilet. It seems to me from Toto's literature that the Cadet's rim isn't wide enough (dimension D under "Dimensional Requirements"). The literature says the width needs to be at least 18" (9" from center, but I'm simply doubling it). My Cadet is only 14" wide at the widest part of the rim. Am I reading this correctly?

    Thanks in advance!

    Sincerely,
    Gary

  9. #339

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Swart View Post
    Why do people continue to buy not only American Standard and Kohler toilets even though they have problems?
    Maybe not everyone has problems. I bought a Cadet 3 for my bath reno after seeing many great reviews and I was happy with the design after a tank upgrade. I figured for 1/3 the cost of a Toto I would take the chance. Its been over 2 years and I have not 1 complaint. It NEVER takes more than 1 flush.

  10. #340
    DIY Junior Member simonC's Avatar
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    Default Cadet 3 Round Front Toilet

    I installed two basic Cadet 3 Roundfront Toilets (6 Liters) in our household of 5 adults around September 2009, and both have been working well with no problems for 2 years now. Great flush, fast and not noisy, never need 2 flushes (to my memory), even though I adjusted early the water-level to just under 5 liters ! Its superior performance compared to our previous 13 L toilets, which did not flush sometimes, can be explained as follows :

    1) The flush-valve is 3 inches, much larger than the 2" in most toilet tanks, thus giving a stronger water down-flush. Same as the top-rated Toto toilets which are more expensive.

    2) The trapsize is 2 1/8", which is said to be about the average today or slightly more. The minimum standard was 1 1/2". Champion has larger trapsizes and Caroma has 3" and 4". It is sufficient anyhow to our experience.

    3) The trapway is glazed, allowing a smoother pass ( I have checked it with my hand, though it didn't feel fully glazed inside, or as smooth as the outside).

    4) The wide water-surface area (9" x 8") should be a contributing feature also.

    Another feature is that it fits into our bathroom floor rough-in which is less than 12" perfectly (measured from the flange-hole center to the back wall), since the Cadet 3 toilet rough-in is measured about 11 1/2" (from the bowl-outlet center to the tank's back). Our former toilet has an exact 12" rough-in, which caused a misalignment with our flange-hole, a ' tilted ' tank, and water leak troubles in our bathroom to downstairs ! However, if your floor rough-in is 12" or more, you could see a small gap between the tank and wall.

    Only one complication in our case. I found some waterdrops appearing nonstop at the tank's bottom after installation. Eventually, I bought a set of tank bolts/nuts/washers that has additional washers and nuts sealing the tank bottom's openings where the bolts come out, and there was no more water dripping. I sealed the second toilet similarly without testing first. I further put some Duct tapes on the first tank's bottom and back just in case of condensation.

    Also, I used ' nylon ' nuts (white plastic) instead of the common ' brass ' nuts to prevent rusting, which has caused me much trouble in removing the toilet from the floor, and separating the bowl and tank. Moreover, I put washers and nylon nuts onto the floor bolts to ' fix ' them to the flange, so I could ' center ' the toilet bowl-outlet with the flange-hole surely without shifting the bolts' positions, as the bowl touched them during installation. This off-center misalignment has caused water leak problems to our ceiling downstairs before !

    I bought each roundfront bowl (3011.016.020) and lined tank (4021.500.020) at a home depot store in Toronto for about $200 Canadian dollars - a great deal considering many more expensive toilets simply do not flush as well ! And many use more water still ! The outer design of Cadet 3 looks very nice either. Can't find a better deal.
    Last edited by simonC; 10-07-2011 at 08:43 AM. Reason: To be more accurate in some details

  11. #341
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    Our Cadet has ben installed for 16 months. Works perfectly. Never had to flush twice. Mechanism is fine and has never plugged. Works as a toilet should! I would recommend this unit to anyone!

    Moisheh

  12. #342
    DIY Junior Member ab8's Avatar
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    Default American Std Cadet 3 Flowise 4.8L with multiple defects

    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Yes, that's your leak. The large plastic nut may need to be tightened.
    If snugging it up doesn't fix it, you can remove the flush valve, inspect the china inside the tank, and sand smooth if needed.
    Thank you for above comment! Here's my review of American Std Cadet 3 Flowise 4.8L with multiple defects.

    Glad to see some customers are not running into defects. For me, American Standard got it wrong, Home Depot made it right.

    By the way, it does flush OK after Home Depot and I fixed the multiple quality problems:
    1) Had to hold lever down until water makes loud gurgle in bowl, then release (else no flush); there was a styrofoam float missing from top of flapper.
    2) Leak from tank bolt or tank outlet. Found this helpful comment above: "As far as I can tell, it's leaking around the sides of the gasket that goes between the tank and the bowl. If I fill the tank and watch that space, I see water starting to well up there, and then eventually start dripping out through the bolt holes... Yes, that's your leak. The large plastic nut may need to be tightened..." There was a gap between the large plastic nut and the rough porcelain surface.
    3) Instructions do NOT correspond to parts, for example, no mention of the extra(?) pair of tight-fitting plastic 'washers' - maybe useful to clip the bowl base bolts into place and stop them wandering while lifting the heavy bowl into place (not mentioned in instructions).
    4) It's a tough job to cut bolts after bowl is installed, so that bolt covers fit properly. Instructions should give an alternative of measuring *very carefully*, put on a nut temporarily, cut off amount indicated by measurement, then re-thread with nut. Use hacksaw or Dremel with cutter blade?

    Tank went back to Home Depot, they exchanged the tank. (If they had to order replacement, I would suggest they order at least 2, so there is a better chance of one being defect-free). There is now a softer gasket, perhaps a design change to fix leak problems. I'm wary of American Standard, there seem to be quality problems. Would give it 2/5 since it does flush OK once the leaks and defects are fixed; includes a handy long nut driver for tightening nuts on tank bolts. Acts like a dual flush now: poke handle and it flushes using part of tank (about 3 liters), hold handle down and it empties tank (about 5 liters).

  13. #343
    DIY Junior Member gzaryz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by achutch View Post
    Below is part of my post dated 04-12-2008 that refers to the defective Cadet 3 bowls. Today I found a defect in "Bowl #4" that goes beyond cosmetic which I consider serious.

    We have been noticing a foul odor like stale urine that seems to be coming from inside the toilet bowl (not on the floor or anywhere else -- both of us have good noses). Until now, I have NEVER had a toilet that smells. This morning, after I noticed that the smell had gotten worse, I took a hand mirror and looked underneath the rim. See attached photos of the separation of the glaze between the rim and the bowl. I believe that this may be where the odor is coming from.

    While the toilet performs well (never a clog or a leak), a stench is unacceptable. We're giving it another good scrubbing with bleach, but my guess is that it will be going out the door and replaced with a Toto like the one in the main bathroom.

    achutch

    The bowls, all made in the US, had quality issues.

    The first bowl rocked because of a slight projection on the bottom between the horn and the front part of the base that hadn't been trimmed, UNACCEPTABLE. That one was returned.

    The second bowl didn't rock and the projection was trimmed out. However, there was a gross imperfection of a seam inside the bowl at the bottom where the water goes out which had been permanently stained blue (fired in), UNACCEPTABLE. So in late afternoon during rush hour, it got returned. I, now quite cross, informed the person at the return desk that I expected a rep from the plumbing department to meet with me, and together we would inspect every Cadet 3 bowl until I found one that was acceptable.

    After looking at another bowl and finding a flaw in the glazing in the same area as bowl #2, the plumbing rep brought down a pallet of Cadet 3 bowls. Luckily, the first box he opened contained an acceptable bowl, though not flawless. Bowl #4 was brought home, is now up and running, and to its credit, it works well.
    Had to create and account to reply to this thread, since I've been lurking here for months and decided to go to the 'Depot to pick up a couple Cadets to replace the builder grade Mansfields in my house. Wow, the quality control issues were not exaggerated. Both bowls with cock-eyed just like the pictures, but worse was under the rim. Both were flawed, much like this picture, but way worse.

    One had this defect around at least 70% of the rim. Disgusting. The other had it in about 3 spots that were about 3 inches long. Both went back and the mansfield's back on a new wax ring until the Drakes I ordered online arrive. I'm kicking myself for not taking pictures. Maybe a Cadet from a *real* plumbing supply house won't have these defects, but i will NEVER buy another American Standard from Home Depot again. That's for sure, and both companies are getting a short nastygram from me because of this experience. Begin the "I told you so's"!

  14. #344
    DIY Junior Member gzaryz's Avatar
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    Oh, forgot to mention that the exit part of the trap was different than in all the pictures too. On both Cadets, there was no little "hump" before exiting, it made that flat almost 90 horizontally across the floor to the exit, just like all the other cheapos. The display model at the store had the hump. The two I got, none. Buyer beware, or at least open that box and inspect it before taking it home.

  15. #345
    DIY Junior Member joe01880's Avatar
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    Default Right is Right

    Right is right and I was wrong and am paying for it.

    I read reviews here and elsewhere on the Cadet 3 Flowise. They were on sale ay Home Depot so i bought one to replace the misserable excuse for a toilet my wife and I have been plunging eveytime we use it it seems for the last 6 years.

    WOW does it flush great, does it flush down fecal matter well? I'll never know, the damn tank bolts leaked, nothing I did helped, just made more of a mess. Putting a level on it the casting is not flush either on the bowl portion. I double checked my install, the floor is level and all was done properly. The toilet was simply cast defective.

    I called AS and I called Home Depot, they both agreed it should be returned for a replacement. Once was enough. I figured out of the thousands made what are the chances I would get a defect described in these and other forums. I got exactly that. Having read this forum I figured why do the same job three times. I called around and found a TOTO Drake closer to me than the Home Depot was. I uninstalled the Cadet 3 and pulled a muscle in my back and neck while carrying the heavy damn thing to the truck. Home Depot got it back, I opted for a full refund and stopped by the plumbing supply store up the street and bought the last TOTO Drake they had in stock. I figured the exrta $60 and pulled muscles were my punishment.

    It took no more time to install the Drake then did the Cadet 3 and DOES NOT LEAK from its tank bolts, It seems to flush just as forceful as the Cadet 3. I still don’t know how it does on fecal matter, nature hasn’t made that call yet but it has to be better than the no name lame excuse for a toilet it replaced.


    When your right, your right.

    Joe

    EDIT: So far so good, the TOTO Drake has flushed the best we can throw at it so far on the first flush with no plunger needed.
    Neither my wife nor I care for the TOTO slow close seat. I will be replacing that with something more comfortable to us.
    Last edited by Terry; 01-20-2014 at 10:47 AM.

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