American Standard Cadet 3 Three Toilet consumer product review

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Ian Gills

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From a user's point of view I have sat on my fair share of Toto commercial and residential toilets and have not found their performance or quality to be that far ahead of my Cadet 3, if at all.

The Lufthansa business class lounge at Dulles Airport has Toto toilets. They're nice but not so far ahead of my Cadet 3 to make me think about changing my toilet.

My most recent hotel on vacation to the Keys had a Toto Guinevere. Again, no big deal.

I really do not see what all the fuss is about.

The Cadet 3 is a well-priced, good toilet that flushes (almost) as well as any Toto I have sat on. And mine came neatly out of the box as well. So it looks like at least two of us have been struck by lighting, eh? And I know there are more that have not had any problems and are pleased.

The one thing that does stand out is Toto brassware however. I like their flush valves in commercial operation, but I do not see them that often.

But with porcelain products I'll take my chances thank you.
 
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miracj

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Hi Terry,

I sell the Bone Toto Dalton comfort height for $202
The Bone Toto Drake RF for $279

Unless I'm mistaken, a Dalton is 1.6 gallons, so that is comparing an apple to an orange since I wanted a 1.28 gallon or better.

The Drake bone, elongated delivered to me (Boston, MA) is about $285 on the internet. I could not find a local dealer that could match anything even close to that (plus I'd pay a 5% tax)

However, an operational unit is important. A DIY-er needs to be able to return a problem item locally for replacement, otherwise he'd have to pay return shipping (not cheap or easy for toilets). A professional has other options. So it was not practical to return a Drake if a problem did occur.

Hi Ian,

The Cadet 3 is a well-priced, good toilet that flushes (almost) as well as any Toto I have sat on. And mine came neatly out of the box as well. So it looks like at least two of us have been struck by lighting, eh? And I know there are more that have not had any problems and are pleased.

I can't compare the two as I can't say I've sat and used many Toto's, but it seems that the Cadet 3 Flowise has more than met my needs for non-clogging and water consumption (and wife's needs for bone color).

And it always interesting in forums that you hear way more complaints than praises, so the results are skewed by the # of users of something. I suspect American Standard probably sells a whole lot more units than Toto (at least in the USA) and looking at forum comments is not statistically useful to indicate quality. Nevertheless, I always check forums, comments and reviews before a big or important purchase, looking for the negatives to see what problems or issues one might potentially run into. The trick is to weigh those comments as
1. being valid,
2. being typical vs rare, and
3. being important and relevant to your purchase​

And struck by lightning? If someone wants to stand on a golf course with a metal iron club in your hand during a thunderstorm, go ahead :D :eek: I prefer to make my own luck by researching my purchases! ;)
 

Terry

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Personal experience is what I go by, not reading posts from Ian every few posts.

attachment.php

Cadet with Korky replacement fill valve and Korky replacement flapper.
The same parts a Toto would use.
Also, replacement trip lever.

attachment.php

Cadet with replacement Toto Softclose seat.

I realize that Ian's Cadet had the trip lever replaced, the flapper, the fill valve and he put on a Toto Softclose seat.
This is your second valid example?

So when Ian says it's like sitting on a Toto, it's the Toto seat that he put on his A/S

I sell a few thousand toilets a year, and many plumbers also notice the quality problems with American Standard.
It's not made up.
When I meet other plumbers at the whole sale supply house, I they feel the same way.
Too many times they have been bitten by the defect bug, and had to spend time replacing bad bowls and tanks.
Really, I think purchasing a few thousand products a year trumps the two purchases from you two guys.
Especially since Ian has replaced every part on his already.
What part of that do you not get?
There are a lot of happy HD buyers that don't mind chipped porcelain.
But when a plumber sells you shit like that, the homeowner gets a lot pickier.

A second point is that your state requires you to pay sales tax on all purchases, even those shipped in.
By not reporting the sales tax to your local state, it doesn't make you smart.
It makes you a criminal.

Quality,
Have you ever seen the lumber sold at big box.
I wouldn't use it to make a dog house.
I'm sure you thing that stuff is good too.
Homeowner grade is what they call it.

Big box also carries their own line of faucets with more metal taken out and replace with plastic.
The plumbers know that, that's why we won't buy the junk they sell.
They kind of look the same, but they are made cheaper.
Look at the Moen web site, they have two number systems,
One for dummies that are too dumb to notice.
And one for people that want it right the first time.
 
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miracj

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Hi Terry,

Personal experience is what I go by, not reading posts from Ian every few posts.

Not doubting that in the least. I always look at many independent "Intelligent" reviews and opinions (leaves CR out I guess :D ). And if a plumber, I would never risk a callback or issue. It's not worth it. A DIY-er, has a different perspective. Recourse if he has a problem, available local parts, long-term availability of parts, etc.

I realize that Ian's Cadet had the trip lever replaced, the flapper, the fill valve and he put on a Toto Softclose seat.
This is your second valid example?

So when Ian says it's like sitting on a Toto, it's the Toto seat that he put on his A/S
Based on failures reported on the flapper, I based my total cost on including a replacement Korky flapper. Trip lever and softclose seat (no matter the brand) are a user choice that Ian made. But it doesn't imply the reliability of his Cadet 3.

Really, I think purchasing a few thousand products a year trumps the two purchases from you two guys.

Absolutely for a plumber, or for someone who sell fixtures. A DIY-er has slightly different needs and requirements.

Especially since Ian has replaced every part on his already.

What part of that do you not get?

That's a bit unfair to Ian, as they are not operational or reliability issues (except possibly the flapper which may have already been addressed in it's current design)

There are a lot of happy HD buyers that don't mind chipped porcelain.
But when a plumber sells you shit like that, the homeowner gets a lot pickier.

I wouldn't accept it from either a plumber or HD.

A second point is that your state requires you to pay sales tax on all purchases, even those shipped in.
By not reporting the sales tax to your local state, it doesn't make you smart.
It makes you a criminal.

Reality says that almost all people buying things over the internet or in NH (which is tax-free) don't pay the sales tax, although they are expected to pay the difference from state tax in what's called a use tax. I can't imagine 99.99% of the people buying their DVDs, CDs, Games, Videos ad-infinitum online or anywhere else on the web or by mail-order ever actually paying this tax, so the comparison still holds. Even if you add the $15 sales tax to the web orders, they were still close to $100 lower than local dealers/plumbers.

Big box also carries their own line of faucets with more metal taken out and replace with plastic.

And that is absolutely true! When I buy at a big-box store, I am real careful when I see model numbers that are not identical to the manufacturer's numbers. This definitely hold's true for lawn mowers, snow blowers and many other items. Sometimes it's doesn't include certain accessories, e.g. a toilet seat (thus costing another $10 to $60). Caveat-Emptor.

I always make sure if I know what I'm really buying and weigh the applicability to the use, final cost and reliability. Of course, not everyone does their homework either.

The Toto line is clearly a quality toilet, and anyone who did not consider them wouldn't be very smart. But the final costs, at least in my part of the country, were not in my budget.

Regards,

Ira

attachment.php

The black rubber on the Cadet 3 Flapper starts to blister, this one is six months old.
 
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organic_smallhome

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Hi Terry,


I wouldn't accept it from either a plumber or HD.

Regards,

Ira

Hi Ira,

You might want to check with your plumber. My plumber (I'm in a suburb of Boston) told me that his fee for the Drake, installed, is $475. That includes purchase of toilet (that he picks up).

best of luck!
 

Ian Gills

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Look, I am just posting in a review section about a toilet I own having spent a few bucks on parts that I did for the love of it.

Plumbers spend an hour-a-time installing these.

I have spent three years sitting on one.

You judge for yourself whether my opinion counts?
 
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Ian Gills

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FloridaOrange, let's not mix business with pleasure please.

Besides it's the Sabbath and we do not do drywalling on a Sunday. Today is a day for rest, family and friends and I consider my Cadet 3 to be one of my closest buddies.

I encourage you all to take the Cadet 3 challenge. I know you have some round the back Terry, so ask one of your boys to pull that Toto in the master bath of yours and install one of these. Just for a week. You might be pleasantly surprised. :)
 

Terry

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Ian,
You forget, I'm a plumbing contractor that sells toilets.
We sell the Cadet, and I have used it.

You are the one that needs to pull a toilet and put in something else,
Then you will know what I'm talking about.

I installed some Cadets for a preschool, very cost conscious people too.
The next toilets they bought they went back to the Toto Drake.
No more Cadets for them.
 
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Stephjam

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I've learned quite a bit from posts on this thread and I appreciate everyone's input. I'm starting to lean toward the Toto Drake (elongated), but I have a few more questions.

1) For a 12" rough-in, what is the total length from the rear wall to the front of the bowl? I've looked at the spec sheet. Would it be 29 1/4" ? Again, my bathrooms are small and I'm replacing round toilets so, believe it or not, going with elongated will be cutting it very close as far as opening the bath door in one room or getting into the shower in the other. Sure I could go back to round, but I prefer the elongated.

2) Is the sana-gloss worth the extra money? I don't mind cleaning a toilet every two or three weeks. I've come across a few posts on other web sites where the owners were very dissapointed with the sana-gloss.

3) Terry, do you ship to Atlanta?

Thanks

S-
 

Terry

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It seems a bit silly talking about nice toilets in the Cadet 3 review.
It's like dropping a Lexus review on a Ford Taurus.
I owned a Ford Taurus once, once was enough, the repairs were killing me.

1) For a 12" rough-in, what is the total length from the rear wall to the front of the bowl? I've looked at the spec sheet. Would it be 29 1/4" ? Again, my bathrooms are small and I'm replacing round toilets so, believe it or not, going with elongated will be cutting it very close as far as opening the bath door in one room or getting into the shower in the other. Sure I could go back to round, but I prefer the elongated.

It would be about 29-1/8" with the elongated Drake and 28-7/8" with the Ultramax.

2) Is the sana-gloss worth the extra money? I don't mind cleaning a toilet every two or three weeks. I've come across a few posts on other web sites where the owners were very dissapointed with the sana-gloss.
For myself and my customers, they find that CEFIONTECT helps.
One airline pilot started with one, and then replaced all of his toilets with CEFIONTECT.

3) Terry, do you ship to Atlanta?
Toto is manufactured in Atlanta, no, you are better off picking it up locally.
Maybe you can even get a tour of the factory there.
 
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Stephjam

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Thanks for all the help Terry. I know it may seem silly to you to be talking about a Toto in a Cadet thread, but I posted in this thread first because I very seriously considering buying a Cadet 3, but I have since been converted to the Toto Drake mostly because of all of the helpful info I 've received as result of your forum.
 

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Cadet 3 - Flush Right System VS Cadet 3 Flushing System???

In shopping for toilets I came upon this great site! Perhaps Terry or someone else can help...After reading many reviews on the Cadet 3 toilet I think I am decided upon purchasing this one but have stumbled across a few unanswered questions that I cannot find on the AS website or anywhere! They advertise a Cadet 3 with the 'Cadet 3 Flushing System' model 2880 AND then the Cadet 3 with the 'Flush Right System' Model 2383/84/86 (I am from Canada if this makes a difference in model numbers and products etc.) I would like to know what the difference is between the models and more importantly the difference between flushing systems??? I cannot find any information on the Flush Right system! Home Depot sells the one with the flush right system model 2383 for $209-$250 and before I purchase I want to know if there is a difference between the flushing systems as I cannot find info anywhere. Also does thie model 2383 have the Everclean surface as well cuz it does not say this anywhere on that particular model at Home Depot. Does anyone have the Everclean surface toilets and does it work/help?? Do you notice it for cleanliness?? Thanks for all the help, love this site!
 

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Cadet 3 quality problem

Hi

I just recently put in two Cadet 3 RH Elongated toilets. If you get a good one, they work great. Quality is the problem and that's why Toto' cost more...quality. I went to Home Depot and went through 9 bowls and tanks until I found 2 that were suitable. The others had glaze problems, trapway wasn't smooth, marks embedded in the glazing, poor fit. I hate to think of the poor people who bought all those toilets that I rejected. What plumber would want to waste time doing that, when they can just go get a Toto and know the quality inspection has already been done for them.

Thanks for the forum Terry. It educated me to make a decision that was good for me and I knew walking in that I had to inspect each toilet BEFORE I left the store.
 
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gurgler

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Bowl wash problem

We bought a Cadet 3 ADA hgt elongated about 2 months ago. Reading here about problems buying possible seconds from big box stores, bought ours from a local plumbing supply house. All the holes and the main drain were not perfectly smooth, but my plumber said "good enough!" Good points: one flush does the job every time. The toilet looks nice. Bad point: bowl wash not so good. If anything brown gets on the sides above the water spot, it's got to be cleaned with a brush. Any brown intially left within the water spot will disappear soon, possibly due to the gloss finish. We're now looking to replace an old unit in the first floor powder room, most likely to be used by guests, so unfortunately we are looking for something other than the Cadet 3 just because of the bowl wash. Love our Cadet 3 otherwise! Hope we don't have to go with the expensive and, to me, ugly-looking Soiree or Guinevere (YMMV!). Looking for an alternative with good bowl wash that flushes as well as the Cadet 3.
 

Ian Gills

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I'd be interested in hearing what you find and how it goes.

To get a good bowl wash for a 1.6gpf toilet is going to be difficult, so please report back if you find (and actually test) a winner.

I have always cleaned my toilet every week as I clean my house. So I have never really had a problem with keeping the Cadet 3 clean.

But I agree that it can get mucky if you leave it a month or so.
 
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