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Thread: Pex And Freezing Winter Temperatures

  1. #16
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    I don't claim to know all of the applicable codes or specs. This is from their spec sheet:

    CERTIFICATIONS
    The
    SharkBite Push-Fit fittings have been design certified to IGC 188.The SharkBite Push-Fit fittings are
    listed by
    IAPMO and are certified for potable and hydronic heating water distribution (note: Glycol mixture for
    hydronics should not exceed 50% concentration).The
    SharkBite Push-Fit fittings have been certified for
    underground applications and as a manufactured joint without access panels and they meet
    UPC, IPC and

    cUPC requirements.The SharkBite Push-Fit fittings are design certified ANSI/NSF Standard 61.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  2. #17
    Plumber/Gasfitter dubldare's Avatar
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    They're in a grey area until the next codes come out---happens all the time with new stuff.
    --Customers of plumbers: Never be afraid to ask for proof of licensure of the plumber servicing your equipment. A licensed plumber will be proud to show you his personal license.--

  3. #18
    Master Plumber Dunbar Plumbing's Avatar
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    What's amazing was the fact that the connection swivels so easily but doesn't leak.

    Like I stated, it was an emergency situation, no way in hell was a glue joint going to hold in this scenario whatsoever.

    Naturally if this was all copper I would of never even thought of using one.

    I paid out the nose for them at Ace Hardware. Supply houses in your area will have better pricing jadnashua.


    I'm from the old school of plumbers line of thinking even though I'm 37; I believe that simplicity (sharkbites) take away from the true profession and it seems that when something is too easy, it has drawbacks.
    Read what the end of this sentence means.

  4. #19
    Plumber/Gasfitter dubldare's Avatar
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    I'm 33 and they look at me like I'm some kind of nazi, lol.
    --Customers of plumbers: Never be afraid to ask for proof of licensure of the plumber servicing your equipment. A licensed plumber will be proud to show you his personal license.--

  5. #20
    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking shark bites are a god-send

    I used them today.. they work great


    and in these parts they are ok to install undergournd...


    I dont see what the difference is anyway....


    you can "half ass" throw in

    crimp type pex fittings all day long

    in million dollar homes and hope that they hold up

    for a few years and then let someone else worry about it

    "down the road "



    I have used them quite a bit and they work just fine..

    they are jsut as sturdy as any plastic wirsbo fitting I have seen

    and look much more professional than any crappy Kitech job .



    So now we can all sit back and see if the shark bite fittings gives out

    before the chlorine in the water starts to break apart the pex

    fittings and pipe...



    so my opinion is

    if it is good for the goose , then its good for the gander...... .

  6. #21
    DIY Senior Member OldPete's Avatar
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    I don't know how chlorine can break down brass fittings...

  7. #22
    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking that is exactly my point pete

    That is my point pete......

    the brass fitting wont wear out...

    which will wear out first.....

    the seal inside the brass shark-bite fittings

    or the PEX fittings , shitty crimp rings, and different pex pipes
    being exposed to high chlorine levels....

    lets wait ten--fifteen years and get back to me..




    I took that first pic off just to not offend all the true professionals here on this site....

    here is an updated pic from last week.... minor drywall has been done

    .but I know it still jsut isnt pretty enough for you all....

    now remember....
    the whole manifold is just hanging there on the wall with only a few nails
    holding it in place....
    Last edited by master plumber mark; 01-19-2008 at 06:11 PM.

  8. #23
    Master Plumber Dunbar Plumbing's Avatar
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    Default Picture isn't big enough

    Can you get the picture any larger?


    A statement about brass fittings:


    I've seen the thinness of the brass fittings used in PEX and why they don't make those fittings thicker is beyond me.


    Those Mueller ball valves, junk. I won't install them because the socket for the piping is thin brass and give it 3 years and they start to cancer out and leak.

    I stick to Nibco and I can't bring myself to buy premier ball valves even though they are cheap. The assembly is always loose.

    I went ahead and gave up my last two service calls tonight; too tired and my feet have been cold and wet now for 3 days straight. Time for a much needed break. I start laughing when I get a call to fix a broken water line as I'm beat down. The crazy thing is that when the temperature starts to rise up towards 30 is when a bunch of calls come in.

    I turned down a water pump call for a trailer that sits inside of a freezer chest outside the trailer. LOL!!!! Not gonna, don't wanna.
    Last edited by Dunbar Plumbing; 02-07-2007 at 03:32 PM.
    Read what the end of this sentence means.

  9. #24
    DIY Senior Member OldPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RUGGED
    Can you get the picture any larger?


    A statement about brass fittings:


    I've seen the thinness of the brass fittings used in PEX and why they don't make those fittings thicker is beyond me.


    Those Mueller ball valves, junk. I won't install them because the socket for the piping is thin brass and give it 3 years and they start to cancer out and leak.

    I stick to Nibco and I can't bring myself to buy premier ball valves even though they are cheap. The assembly is always loose.

    I went ahead and gave up my last two service calls tonight; too tired and my feet have been cold and wet now for 3 days straight. Time for a much needed break. I start laughing when I get a call to fix a broken water line as I'm beat down. The crazy thing is that when the temperature starts to rise up towards 30 is when a bunch of calls come in.

    I turned down a water pump call for a trailer that sits inside of a freezer chest outside the trailer. LOL!!!! Not gonna, don't wanna.
    The Wirs/Uponor brass fittings I use are full thickness and far from cheap ($ or made). That pex looks messy... nothing is clamped down after the valves?

  10. #25
    Rancher
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    Quote Originally Posted by master plumber mark
    here is a new house under construction I had to repair where the copper valves all froze but the wirsbo fitting
    Can I ask a stupid question... why would someone pay to put in that manifold array of ball valves so they could shut off every outlet of their plumbing in the house separately? Were they planning on having LOTS of plumbing problems in the future? Oh and you need to close the valves to the water softener before you turn the water back on.

  11. #26
    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking Messey pex????

    That pex looks messey ????


    that looks good compaired to some of the jobs in Wirsbo I
    have seen out there..


    as far as tacking up and secureing
    the lines ...the house is not finished yet either....




    the manifold was what the customer wanted....

    and for a little bit more effort, it would be about what
    I would do in my own home.....isolate each bathroom with ball valves..


    a Wirsbo a pex manifold would have looked much, much
    sloppier than the combo of both....




    so whats the difference in costs anyway??
    about 50 bucks in ball valves.....


    if it makes them happy..... then its worth it.
    Last edited by master plumber mark; 02-08-2007 at 09:12 AM.

  12. #27
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Just an observation... it looks to me as if some of those valves won't be capable of shutting off because the handle will hit the valve to the left...

    And the design of the "manifold", I'd be concerned about flow rates and velocity limits. They're feeding the whole house with 3/4" and the manifold is 3/4" while feeding other 3/4" lines off the manifold; including one line for the whole bathroom cold or hot water needs? I would have expected 1" from the street and for the manifold. And are the two 3/4" stubs on the right for irrigation, pool, outside faucets with only a 3/4" feed?

    Mark, there have been seals, gaskets and o-rings used in water using appliances like clothes and dish washers and their pumps, all types of fixtures, toilets, coffee makers etc., water pumps and all water treatment equipment (filters and softeners) on chlorinated water for the last 50+ years. There are damned few leaks caused by chlorine.

    Brass has been used on chlorinated waters for like a hundred years. And in K, L and M copper tubing forever. Even galvanized pipe and nipples. With the exception of galvanized, all with minimal leaking/corrosion/damage due to chlorine. The same should be true with today's use of chloramines.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  13. #28
    Master Plumber master plumber mark's Avatar
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    Talking everybody is a critic...LOL

    those valves will all turn off.... all installed by the dummey

    typeing this post......so its no big deal.....

    its on a well and the flow rate is NA

    eventually they will get a water conditioner ...

    Probably a 48,000 CLACK

    It is all isolated for various reasons of my own choosing....


    you really HAVE to be there to understand what I am dealing with...


    the homeowners let this place freeze up after I had plumbed it
    once already,

    so I had to go back out and re do all those valves....

    then winterize the home

    again , I was very impressed with the WIRSBO --no freeze problems on the pex side


    as far as the brass and pex and chlorine,

    you mis-understood my sarcasm.....

    got more troubles to deal with....later

  14. #29
    Master Plumber Dunbar Plumbing's Avatar
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    Default Back to the subject line

    What IS the effective way to unthaw plastic piping?

    You can't open up the walls, that only happens when the pipes do it for you.

    I unthawed two copper lines yesterday at a barber shop without anything more than a torch.

    Customer were estatic that I didn't have to fix, anything.

    This PEX is already somewhat in my area.......just in the condos and landominiums.

    I'm thinking they are SOL ???? I'd rather have that problem than property damage anyday.
    Read what the end of this sentence means.

  15. #30

    Default

    If you're not in too big of a hurry and it is a very small area you can seal up...mount a hairdryer in there and leave it on low or medium...might take a couple of hours but it beats tearing out the wall. Also...there are some really kewl dog grooming hair dryers that are made to be left on for long periods of time which work great for such applications.

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