Replacement well pump advice

[Joe Schmo]

Hello,

I’m am looking for some advice on a replacement well pump. My well was dug in 2013 to a total depth of 360’ and it is a 4” casing. The specs sheet say that it was pumped at a rate of 25 gpm for 2 hours and the water level dropped from 125’ to 140’.


The previous owner had the old pump reused and it is .5 hp, 5gpm pump set to a column length of 180’. The line down the well is 1” poly and the line coming into the house is 1” with a length of 35’.


I tested the gpm coming into the house and I only get 7.5 gpm which is the main reason I want to upgrade the pump. 7.5 gpm is not nearly enough for my family. I originally wanted to install the largest pump possible so that home improvements (bathrooms, work shop, sprinkler systems etc) would not be an issue but I did not realize the size of the pressure tank that I would need. The recommendation at that time was Grundfos 22SQ15-220. I also do not want to dig up the old line in the yard and replace it with a larger one. My current thought is to go with 15SQ15-290 and just neck it down from 1-1/4” to 1” at the pump. I’ll measure the actual gpm and size the tanks accordingly. I’m also in need of a water softener and an acid neutralize, ph a year ago was 4 so it will probably have to be soda ash. Those will be sized after I get true GPM value and test the water after pump install.


What’s everyone’s thoughts on my situation and pump choice? I wanted to get some opinions before ordering the pump. Thanks in advance!

 

[Valveman]

With 4" casing the 3" SQ pump is probably a good idea. However, most 4" pumps will fit in 4" casing and cost a lot less. Looks like your well will make as much water as you want and is being pumped from no deeper than 140'. The 15SQ15-290 is made for a much deeper well. The 10SQ10-250 is still probably more than you need as it will produce about 14 GPM at that depth and pressure. If you want more water use the 22SQ15-220 instead.

You can still install the largest pump you think you could use and a large pressure tank is not needed. Normally a large tank is needed to reduce the on/off cycling, which happens when your pump is producing more than is being used at the time. However, using a Cycle Stop Valve stops the cycling and only requires a 4.5 gallon size tank. The CSV will supply a strong constant 50 PSI to the house instead of a continual 40 to 60 over and over as the old pressure tank systems do. There are lot of other benefits to having a CSV as well.

 

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[Joe Schmo]

With 4" casing the 3" SQ pump is probably a good idea. However, most 4" pumps will fit in 4" casing and cost a lot less. Looks like your well will make as much water as you want and is being pumped from no deeper than 140'. The 15SQ15-290 is made for a much deeper well. The 10SQ10-250 is still probably more than you need as it will produce about 14 GPM at that depth and pressure. If you want more water use the 22SQ15-220 instead.

You can still install the largest pump you think you could use and a large pressure tank is not needed. Normally a large tank is needed to reduce the on/off cycling, which happens when your pump is producing more than is being used at the time. However, using a Cycle Stop Valve stops the cycling and only requires a 4.5 gallon size tank. The CSV will supply a strong constant 50 PSI to the house instead of a continual 40 to 60 over and over as the old pressure tank systems do. There are lot of other benefits to having a CSV as well.

Thanks for the reply. What other brand pumps would you suggest? I am simply downsizing what was suggested by a pump sales website. When we talked he came up with a total head of 290 ft and I came up with something similar but I can’t find my notes on it.

I can’t find the pump 10SQ10-250. The only thing close in 10gpm is 10sq07-240 and 10sq10-290. Also, why do you skip from 10gpm to 22gpm and not recommend a 15gpm pump. For the graphs it looks like I would be getting 16gpm with the 15SQ15-290, maybe a little less after necking it down.

I’ve considered a CSV valve but I wanted to make sure I could at least fit/afford the proper size tanks if I took the conventional route.

 

[Bannerman]

I wanted to make sure I could at least fit/afford the proper size tanks

Is there anything wrong with your current pressure tank? In utilizing a CSV with whatever pump you choose including the 22 gpm model, assuming your existing pressure tank is not damaged, it can likely continue to be used thereby eliminating the expense for a new tank.

 

[Joe Schmo]

Is there anything wrong with your current pressure tank? In utilizing a CSV with whatever pump you choose including the 22 gpm model, assuming your existing pressure tank is not damaged, it can likely continue to be used thereby eliminating the expense for a new tank.

I considered that as well. I put in a new WX-203 two years ago. I was also thinking of depressurizing it and using it as a mixing tank after the soda ash injection system. That’s assuming I didn’t use a CSV and bought a larger tank.

 

[Valveman]

I didn't skip from 10 to 22 GPM. I went from the 15 GPM pump you mentioned (15SQ15) to the 22 GPM because it is the next step up. A WX203 only holds about 7-8 gallons of water and is less than half the size tank you need without a CSV. But the larger the tank the longer water will be coming from the tank instead of the pump and the pressure will be lower for longer. You can't fit or afford a tank large enough to do what a Cycle Stop Valve will do, as that is impossible. The WX203 is several times larger than what you need with a CSV but will work fine.

I am sorry for the typo. I meant to say 15SQ10-250, not the 10 SQ.

290' of head is a good number for your requirements.

 

[Joe Schmo]

I didn't skip from 10 to 22 GPM. I went from the 15 GPM pump you mentioned (15SQ15) to the 22 GPM because it is the next step up. A WX203 only holds about 7-8 gallons of water and is less than half the size tank you need without a CSV. But the larger the tank the longer water will be coming from the tank instead of the pump and the pressure will be lower for longer. You can't fit or afford a tank large enough to do what a Cycle Stop Valve will do, as that is impossible. The WX203 is several times larger than what you need with a CSV but will work fine.

I am sorry for the typo. I meant to say 15SQ10-250, not the 10 SQ.

290' of head is a good number for your requirements.

The typo is what made me think you were jumping from 10 to 22 gpm. Makes sense now lol. You guys see any serious issue reducing from. 1.5” to a 1” if I go with the 22 gpm pump? I would try my current setup with just a pump replacement vs all new lines. It’s nice to know I can get more gpm in the future by upgrading line size if needed. I think I found residential soda ash injection and water softener rated for 25gpm.

 

[Valveman]

At 22 GPM you will lose about 17 PSI though 100' of 1" plastic pipe. No problem using the 1" pipe but you will probably only get 15-18 GPM at pressure.

 

[Bannerman]

water softener rated for 25gpm.

There are two flow rates applicable to water softeners and back washing filters, Service flow and Peak flow.

Peak flow will be the flow rate the configured equipment will be capable of passing through. Often, sales literature will specify only the Peak rate even as that may not be stated.

Water softening requires the water to have sufficient contact time with the resin media for calcium and magnesium ions to be exchanged for sodium ions. That is not an instantaneous process.

The quantity of regenerated resin within the media tank will govern the flow rate before hardness will begin to leak through the softener. When the flow rate exceeds and continues to increase higher than the service flow rate supported by that quantity of resin, the amount of hardness leakage will also further increase.

If for example, the quantity of resin will support 12 gpm before hardness will begin to leak through, even if the equipment is capable of flowing 13-25 gpm, exceeding 12 gpm will result in increasing hardness leakage to faucets and fixtures utilizing that flow.

Unless your home is equipped with multi-head showers, a large soaker tub or other high flow fixtures, you maybe over estimating the flow rate requirements a family will typically actually need in practice. If you are considering the flow requirements for irrigation, that will utilize water that is not softened.

 

[Joe Schmo]

One bathroom now has a two head fixture and it’s hard to hand wash dishes at the same time. The house is a fixer upper and water needs are going to substantially increase over time especially as the babies grow up. I was looking the fleck 2510 sxt softener with 2.50 cu/ft of resin rated at a peak flow of 25 gpm.

edit: I missed your point. Other than cost, is there an issue with over sizing the water softener. My plan was to size it to flow whatever gpm’s I was getting into the house but it sounds like that may not be the correct approach.

I have intentions of building a large work shop in the back that will be a few hundred feet from the house. Considering that, I’m leaning towards the original 15SQ15-290 pump.

 

[Bannerman]

Best to address water treatment matters once your pump system is decided. This is best addressed in the Water Softener forum.

A current lab test report for the raw well water will also be necessary to take into consideration all water conditions that may impact treatment methods and the equipment to be chosen.

Much of the flow rates achievable to various areas within your home and the pressure loss experienced at each fixture when multiple fixtures are operating, is often determined by the plumbing type and configuration installed within the home. Standard shower heads are typically limited to 2.5 gpm each.