The plumbers broke my faucet

All, I am looking for a sainity check regarding my last dealings with a plumber.

I had a leaking Delta show faucet in my house that I had been unable to repair. When I tried to take it apart nothing would budge so I thought perhaps I was doing something wrong. The plumbers were coming to my house to flush my heating system so I asked them to look at it. I explained to them what I had tried before they started.

Plumber number 1 took out a 12 inch pair of channel locks and after some struggle moved everything about a 1/32 to 1/16th of a turn. He then said to plumber number 2 I am not sure about this. I told both of them if they did not want to work on this they could stop. Plumber number 2 took the channel locks and tweaked on the fittting in both directions. Again nothing budged. As the bad feeling started to rsie in my stomach number 2 said to number 1 trun the water on slowly and surprise surprise the body of the valve was now leaking

Neither of them told me that part of thier "repairs" would or might be breaking the faucet. This story ends with me having them put in a new faucet from there shop and receiving a $450 bill for the job.

As you may have guessed I feel like I was taken for a ride on this one. I know things can break but I would have like to recieved a warning. I think the "right" thing for the pumbers to do would be to charge me for the parts but eat the labor. I am curious as to what others think.

Steve

dumb ass plumbers

they should have known better if they
knew what thet were doing.....

sometimes you have to hack saw that bonnet off
delta faucets because they get galded onto the brass body
by years of lime, soap and sediment......

all they hadto do was saw off that brass bonnett
and then repalce the cartridge , then get a new
bonnettt.....

the pric eyou paid was not outrageous.....but still
if they screwed it up you should not have to pay
for the "on the job training" of the two stooges.....

If you did not twist it off first, I would probably call the
owner and try to get back at least 1/2 f that bill..

Delta

Those boys may have been bulls but they sure weren't repair plumbers because they would have known how to handle the job. You can't squeeze that bonnet and turn it at the same time because when you squeeze you are also grabbing the whole body of the faucet. And yes as a last resort be very careful and cut that bonnet off and when you put the new one on put some plumbers grease on the threads and then plan to repair the faucet every 2 to 4 years.

Remember, all plumbers aren't repair plumbers.

Since the bonnet is just a glorified nut, has anyone had success using a torch to remove one? Seemes like that would loosen 'er up and save the threads.

heating the nut

you can heat that nut on the old style delta

and it will or might give .....

the new style 1500 and 1700 plastic bonnets really make
for a fire and melting plastic issue dripping all over the place...


I have done that before......with the customer
watching me sitting on needled and pins......

I would rather cut the nut with a hack saw or my trusty
Makita Sawzall with a steel cutting blade in it....
then when you are about to get into the threads

snap the bonnet loose with a hammer and cold chisel at the cut......

makeing all the noise with the sawzall and the breaking of the
nut with a sharp cold chisel makes the job look more complicated than it really is ...

of course its all a lot of acting and drama...


that way the customer never questions the bill .......

After being around this buisness for over 30 years, I've learned that when a customer says "Hey, could you take a look at this too...", 97% of the time it's a tar-baby. It's those 'favors' that end up killing you.

Repair work, in general, is an attempt to extend the life of items which may or may not be worthy of repair. Some guys are good, and can turn sows ears into silk purses, while some aren't quite as good at calling their battles.

A guy like Mark knows the risks, and is able to caution you of the risks prior to the attempt of repair. His shoulder tells him 'when to say when' when trying to unscrew that bonnet.

Some guys are eager to please, (or eager to get out of there), and give it too much. Some guys may be the best plumbers in the world, yet lack the communication skills to talk to the customer, and end up gettitng painted as tards.

While you may have had a couple pipefitters working on your stuff, and they should have informed you of the risks, the fact remains that you had a faucet of the poorest design for serviciblility. Three 1/4" copper tubes are all that attatch the mixer portion of the valve to the pipe body. These faucets were not manufactured for longevity.

The only time I would even consider attempting to saw the bonnet nut off one of these would be if it were a fiberglass module set against a concrete or block wall. Other than that, it's coming out if it's not playing nice.

Crap is crap, and I'm learning myself to be more forthright with calling a spade a spade.

Delta

I have never had a Delta faucet break on me as long as I heat the cap nut properly first. And when plumbers or homeowners do twist the valve apart, I repair it for them.

I learned the heat trick from hj on another forum, and it has served me well. 90 percent of ther houses around here are Moen or Delta. I even bought a little butane torch just to heat the Deltas, it's a lot less hassle than my MC tank or Mapp set-up.

I can't even touch one of those valves without telling the customer ahead of time the risks involved. I know what outcome can become of it.

I love repairing those when it does happen when someone calls. I charge just about the same as the thread starter paid.

I believe the customer deserves a reduction in the bill, absolutely.

Any service plumber that doesn't know the trick to those Delta's is green.



I love the new style valves. They should of been doing that all along but then I'd be thousands poorer after the number of changeouts I've done over time.

from what you said

You had a faucet you couldn't repair! It was in disrepair ,then. maybe junk ,we don't know. you got a new faucet and a bill. sounds fair to me. are you looking for a free faucet? You did ask them to look at it ,right? This isn't a hobby for them or there employer

toolaholic said:

You had a faucet you couldn't repair! It was in disrepair ,then. maybe junk ,we don't know. you got a new faucet and a bill. sounds fair to me. are you looking for a free faucet? You did ask them to look at it ,right? This isn't a hobby for them or there employer

Click to expand...

If I go to the Doctor with a sprained ankle and he cuts my foot off, I'm going to sue the hell out of him. There's liability. There's fraud. There's incompetency. There's greed. There's a whole host of issues that could potentially be occurring here that you seem to be overlooking. As Hj said, someone with the skill and know-how can save most any faucet. Sounds like these oafs didn't know what they were doing. It needed seats and springs--that's all.

Verdeboy said:

Since the bonnet is just a glorified nut, has anyone had success using a torch to remove one? Seemes like that would loosen 'er up and save the threads.

Click to expand...

Have fixed many of these faucets, including repairing them after the homeowner or his handyman actually twisted the socket right off the valve body. The key to that valve is patience. Tap the bonnet around the outer edge with either the back of your channel lock pliers or a crescent wrench, periodically trying to remove the nut by hand. Eventually the nut will come loose by hand, quaranteed. Never had it take longer than 20 min. You can loosen the plastic ring that tightens the packing first. This method works 100% of the time if you have the patience.

Try this

http://specialtauto.com/delorean-parts/images/PB-Blaster.jpg

It works.

the risk involved

there is nothing more fun than changeing out

one of those peskey delta faucets after the homeowner has

broken it off in himself.....


when you dont have an access from behind , and you have to

un-solder the valve and re solder in the new valve through that

6 inch hole in the tile with old insulation in the wall.......

make sure your insurance is up to date...

and keep a l;arge spray bottle of water near by


I got some fun pics of my last fire,

but I dont know how to load them up

it is nearly impossible to figure out how to paste and clip


info on how to do this in a painless easy fasion would be apppreciated

The last one of these I did the home owner had twisted the bonnet and tubes right off and ended up taking a unplanned shower/bath.

I just replaced the valve and B4 it was all over ended up being bit by the owners dog and having to undergo 2 rabies treatments.

I fixed mine for 25 cents. The faucet didn't leak, but oh ya, I twisted the thing and busted the lines, but I'm not a plumber, they shoulda known better than me.

You would think so.

You would think so, but it is not uncommon for them not to know about it. Until it happens the first time, a plumber may not realize what will happen. I find plumbers who twist them off all the time. I have fixed them for some plumbers who do not want to replace the valve in an outside wall.

Wow Verd, I Had No Idea

These 2 Guys cut his foot off! No wonder his Mad

toolaholic said:

These 2 Guys cut his foot off! No wonder his Mad

Click to expand...

It's called an analogy.

The saga of the delta bonnet

I am new to this site, but i have had my go arounds with delta fixtures ive tried the heating method, and the sawing action, both to me were not affective, lets face it if u have very hard water flowing through those fixtures its only a matter of a little amount of time before u are putting your channel locks on the nice chrome finish of the beloved bonnet and screwing the whole valve up, and why would i rebuild a valve that will last the customer maybe a year or two?Another point was brought up about trying to solder a new valve from the front?Well break out the smitty plate and lets get to it huh!Nope get the junk out of there, access a hole behind the valve to give yourself enough room to install a new one properly(and not a delta), lets face it id rather have the customer do a sheetrock repair by a qualified or licensed contractor then explain the he or she why my work only lasted a year?or two!!