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View Full Version : Toto Soiree or Guinevere review, installing, comments and pictures



Plunger
01-23-2006, 10:43 AM
http://www.terrylove.com/images/abak/abak_soiree_1.jpg
TOTO Soiree pedestal lav, faucet and toilet suite
http://www.easycarts.net/ecarts/terrylove/Toto_Toilets.html#MS974224CFG

We are considering replacing our awful low flow toilets and have been researching what to replace them with. We have decided to go with a Toto based on what we have read and because of the other people's recommendations that they are happy with theirs. Today we read an article that said that Toto has shown some new lines they have created called the "Soiree" and the "Guinevere" at Home builder shows (that article was dated from Sept 2005.) These models supposedly have Toto's new "double cyclone flush" technology which is supposed to be the latest and greatest thing. Does anyone know if they are for sale yet? Has anybody seen them in action? Are they as good as is claimed? The Toto website shows the Soiree but I don't see anything about Guinevere there. Does anyone know approx how much one of these would cost?


$686.00 for the Soiree and $748.00 for the Guinevere (5/21/2013)
Thanks for any help you can give!

http://www.easycarts.net/ecarts/terrylove/images/ms974_main.jpg (http://www.easycarts.net/ecarts/terrylove/images/ms974_zoom.jpg)

Terry
12-24-2006, 12:10 AM
http://www.terrylove.com/images/soiree_angle.jpg
Toto Soiree

I'm selling the Soiree for $686.00 in White and the Guinevere for $748.00
http://www.terrylove.com/images/soiree_cyclone.jpg
Cyclone Flush System

They both use the double cyclone flush, that sweeps water around the bowl to keep it clean.
The water speeds up as it gets farther down the bowl.
Combined with the Sanagloss finish, it's an improvement over what we have come to expect.
The parts in the tank, are similar to other Toto toilets, so repairs will be easy if needed.
So far, other models like this have had a very good track rating.
Performance seems to be similar to the Toto Ultramax, they both have the large 3" flush valve and siphon jet.
The main difference is how they rinse the bowl.
The Ultramax rinses straight down the bowl, the Soiree and Guinevere have the Cyclone rinse that races around the bowl.
One customer in Spokane said it reminded him of his Ford Cobra.



These are the best Gravity toilets that Toto sells.
The people that own them, tell me they love them.
If you want all the features in one toilet, this is it.


The TOTO Guinevere and the TOTO Soiree.
These are two of what I consider the best of what TOTO has. In the last two years, I've sold 121 of these.
Most are in high end homes, but sometimes just older homes in Seattle.
They look great and flush well.

The best features are the comfort height bowl, the bowl is 16-1/8" before you add for the nice slow closing seat.
The skirted base, which makes for easier cleaning.
When replacing bowls, this is nice, it will cover almost any footprint that has been left on the floor.
Since the back of the bowl is slimmer then the Carlyle, you only need 5-1/2" to the left of center for the shutoff.
Since most plumber rough-in at 6" or more, they will fit almost anywhere.
You also have the option of using the standard 12" rough-in that comes with the toilet, or installing with a 10" or 14" Unifit.

This is great for both older homes, with 14" rough-in, (Many homes in the 20's had 14") or homes with the rough-in too close to the wall.
Parts are easy to get, we use the same basic parts in all of the TOTO toilets, so if you have a part for one, you can pretty much fix the entire lineup.

Real customers are reporting back that they love the toilets.
I have one customer, a neigbor of Bill Gates in Medina, that started with two of the Guinevere, and when he found that he liked them, he ordered three more for a total of five.
Steve Balmer went with the Neorest600 in his master bath, it also has a adapter like the unifit, Sanagloss and double cyclone rinse, but with the added feature of the Washlet seat and automatic functions.
I hear back that he's thinking of getting more of them.

The bread and butter of the TOTO line is the Drake and the Ultramax, and the top of the line is the Guinevere and the Soiree. Unless you are thinking of the Neorest lineup. Off all the brands I'm selling, the Toto has the least problems and the highest customer satisfaction. I sell all brands, and we do about 2,000 toilets a year.

We also see what people are replacing and what they think of those.
Most of the business is made of repeat customers and referrals.
Some brands sell themselves, and some are installed for a short while, until we come to pull them out.
Terry Love
December 4, 2009

SteveW
12-24-2006, 06:29 AM
Terry,
Any thoughts about the flushing action of these? I am torn between getting an Aquia or Soiree. I like the idea of the bowl wash of the Soiree, but am wondering about the flush itself - what do you think?

Terry
12-24-2006, 09:20 AM
Between the two?
Go with the Soiree or the Guinevere.
The Double Cyclone rinse works real well.

The bowl covers more footprint too. The photo above shows that it covered the old toilet outline that had been pressed onto the wood floor.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms974_01.jpg

TPA
12-26-2006, 05:54 PM
I have the Aquia... so far, no complaints whatsoever. Excellent bowl wash compared to the vastly more expensive Toto Pacifica 1-piece toilets I have at my other residence. More bowl wash than the Toto Drakes I have as well. Pretty much sold on Aquias from this point forward, but I've only had them for 2 weeks. Even a 2-day straight binge of various chili & Mexican dishes failed to phase them. Very quiet flush & "petite" size, despite being higher than normal toilets.

The cyclone-jet setup on the Soiree looks interesting on paper, but I've yet to see one in person.

Terry
04-12-2008, 11:34 AM
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms974_02.jpg
Side view of the Guinevere toilet by Toto.
It comes with a nice slow closing seat.

Installation instructions for the Soiree and the Guinevere (http://www.terrylove.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18038&highlight=guinevere+instructions)

Terry
04-23-2008, 04:23 PM
The Soiree has a Unift adapter that fits to the closet flange.
Since the fitting is plastic, you do hear the water leaving the bowl and trapway for a bit after use.
It's sort of a drip, drip, like a clock ticking.
When capillary action has stopped, the sound stops.

Since the trapway on the Ultramax is molded into the porcelain, and even though it too wicks water for a while, it isn't noticeable like it is in the Soiree. After the first few days, you forget the sound is there.
The other day, we installed three more of the Guinevere toilets in a home that started with two, that makes five now. I get a lot of repeat sales from the Soiree and Guinevere.

All bowls on toilets will overfill during a refill.
Most refills take about a minute.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/unifit_1.jpg
The adapter that allows for different rough-in measurements.
The adapter mimics the lower portion of a Drake trapway.

Reader Review
08-05-2008, 06:04 PM
I just want to say that I love my new Guinevere toilet.
It's not new really anymore, I've had it a while.
It has the skirted bowl, Sanagloss which stays clean, and the double cyclone rinse. I picked it up in Wasilla Alaska from Terry Love, I live in Fairbanks.
The other bathroom is very small, I'm thinking of getting the Round front Ultramax for that one. I wish the round came with Sanagloss.
Wynola P
Fairbanks Alaska

Terry
08-30-2008, 06:09 PM
Just did some more work for a customer in Woodinville with three of the Toto Soiree toilets.
She loves the toilets, so much that she called us back to replace lavs in the bathrooms too.

http://www.terrylove.com/images/abak/abak_soiree_1.jpg
TOTO Soiree pedestal lav, faucet and toilet suite

Craig99
12-24-2008, 12:51 AM
I installed a Guinevere today. First Toto owned. Great rim rinse,quiet, great fast flush, quick refill. So far no water splashing on seat.Sanagloss, elongated. When I ordered it at the plumbing shop, I requested 12 inch rough which I assumed was the only way they came. When I got it home and was reading the box it said 10 inch on it. I thought you had to order the 10 or 14 unifit adapter as accessories. But I had a one piece vanity top with a 10 inch shelf so it gives me more access to the tank. 5 1/2 inch offset for fill valve worked ok and the extra 4 inch wall clearance gives me more room for working on it.Question for pros, with the design of the open back for the drop in unifit trap, you can't caulk the back of the toilet for sewer gases. In Cypress, CA the inspectors want the toilets caulked for sewer gases. Unless you caulk the bottom of the back end, set toilet and then caulk the rest on the outside, not sure what else to do. I didn't caulk the back. What do you guys think or do about that?

http://www.terrylove.com/images/abak/abak_guinevere.jpg
TOTO Guinevere pedestal lav and toilet suite

Terry
12-24-2008, 08:52 AM
Wax between the adapter and the floor flange is what seals the sewer gas.

The caulk is to prevent water from going under the bowl from the front.

The Soiree and the Guinevere should come with a 12" adapter in the box.
I have no idea why there would be a 10"
Sometimes for various reasons we will install them with a 10" though.

SamC
12-26-2008, 03:37 PM
Another possibility would be the Gwyneth. It has the double-cyclone technology but not the Unifit, and so is less expensive. It also comes in a two-piece model which is less expensive than the one-piece. Both are 1.28 gallon models.

DaveZmeyr
12-26-2008, 06:14 PM
Bought one of these a couple of months ago and had a general contractor install it, he didn't seem to have any difficulties.

I'm impressed with the flushing action, while it is a little noisier after the flush (during the tank refill) it's nothing that I'm concerned with (especially since I had a sloan flush toilet!).

Definitely is a cool design with how the water washes the bowl and seems to handle whatever is thrown at it.

It's VERY heavy and unlike my other toto toilet, I had to pay extra to get this delivered into the house.

Terry
01-29-2009, 10:33 AM
http://www.terrylove.com/bottomline/bottom_line_header2.jpg (http://www.bottomlinesecrets.com/)


Toto Soiree (http://www.terrylove.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5158&highlight=soiree+guinevere) with SanaGloss / Toto Guinevere (http://www.terrylove.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5158&highlight=soiree+guinevere) with SanaGloss. These toilets have straight sides, ultra smooth finishes and a special glazing that combine to keep surfaces clean with limited scrubbing. Their "Double Cyclone" flushing system use the force of the flush to help scrub the bowl. The are one-piece toilets, so there is no tough-to-get clean gap between the reservoir and the bowl. Price $649.
http://www.terrylove.com/bottomline/ms974.jpg


http://www.terrylove.com/images/terry_pan_sm.jpg Bottom Line Personal interviewed Terry Love, owner of Love Plumbing & Remodel in Bellevue and Bothell, Washington. He has been a plumber since 1974 and currently sells about 3,000 toilets each year. He reviews toilets on his web site. www.terrylove.com/crtoilet.htm (http://www.terrylove.com/crtoilet.htm)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6y348Ho7vQ

mattjd
07-08-2009, 03:35 PM
This site is great. It's helpful to validate that a toilet I liked in a local showroom was decent: the Toto Soiree.

But...the showroom model was a 1.6GPF but when I asked about availability, the woman made some calls and said that apparently the 1.6 is being phased out and Toto is now making it in a 1.28GPF. They had another Double Cyclone 1.28 installed in their bathroom (forget which model) and it looked like it used an awfully tiny amount of water. Has anyone tried the 1.28? Will it flush comparably?

The lower flush costs a few bucks more than the old one and they said they might still be able to hunt an old 1.6 down for me if I really want.

Terry
07-08-2009, 04:02 PM
Either one would be fine.
I have an Ultramax II with 1.28 installed with double cyclone, it works fine.

blevinson
07-09-2009, 11:33 AM
When they use the term eco when describing the Soirée and the Guinevere are they merely talking about the 1.28 GPF toilets?

We have a local rebate program for installing low flow models. It's not much and only covers two toilets, but....

For the 1.6 it's $50 and $100 for the 1.28. Considering the cost of the toilets is it really worth it to buy the 1.28 if available or should they both run about the same?

Reader Review
09-01-2009, 07:10 PM
A friend of mine purchased a Guinevere from you a while ago and is very happy with it.
R Bolger
Los Angeles CA

dinkledoodle
09-02-2009, 12:23 PM
It's worth it to go eco, not only because of the good you do the Earth by saving water, but for the dollar savings from using less water. The toilet is the largest single user of water in the average home (I always thought it was the shower).

The difference from 1.6 to 1.28 gpf is not petty. Saving 20% of your flushing costs can add up really fast. We figured upgrading our Soiree to the eco version will pay for itself in less than 2 years. After that it's all free money.

And then there's that whole saving the planet for future generations thing...:D

Terry
10-15-2009, 02:13 PM
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/thu213.jpg
The handle for the Guinevere
Pretty nice.

midnightshow22
10-30-2009, 11:01 AM
I put a Toto Guinevere into my bathroom (the only one functioning at the moment all the rest are gutted) 2 months ago, and I have had no problems with it.

Terry
11-22-2009, 12:13 PM
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms970_inside_tank.jpg
Looking inside the tank of the Toto Soiree

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms970_pink_3.jpg
A Soiree in an older home in the Ravenna neighborhood.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms970__pink1.jpg
The TOTO Guinevere

These older homes have 14" rough-ins.
Since the Toto with skirted base lets me change the rough-in, I can still pull the bowl back closer to the wall.
I can install these at 10", 12" or 14"

Reader Review
11-27-2009, 03:35 PM
Dear Terry & James,
Thanks so much for all your help.
I love my new TOTO!!!

Maggie
Seattle WA

fred54
01-31-2010, 11:06 AM
I'm thinking of replacing an ancient eljer with a Soiree. My supply is fine left to right (8 inches), however it is 8 1/4" off the floor and Toto says it should be at 4 1/2". Is that a potential problem? It would seem to me that as long as I can connect the supply to the toilet without crimping the flexible connector I should be good?

Thanks.

Terry
01-31-2010, 11:49 AM
My supply is fine left to right (8 inches), however it is 8 1/4" off the floor and Toto says it should be at 4 1/2". Is that a potential problem?

As long as the shutoff doesn't hit porcelain, you will be fine.
There are many ways to bend a supply that doesn't kink.
We've even installed right behind the bowl up high, there is a little indent there, it worked out fine.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/toto_dahl_valve.jpg

lennym
03-05-2010, 10:03 AM
We're trying to choose a toilet for a new bathroom. There are reports on another forum of problems with the washdown of the Guinevere. Could there be a significant performance difference between the original and the "eco" versions? If so can the new ones be retrofitted or tweaked to use 1.6 gallons?

In another bathroom we have had a Toto Carrollton for 6 years and have never had to plunge. The G-Max design seems to generate enough flow so that the siphon pulls the waste down rather than pushing it down. Does the "Double Cyclone" system generate enough flow to do the same thing?

Thanks for any help.

Terry
03-05-2010, 11:20 AM
The 1.28 works fine.
If you look in the bowl, and it looks like you have given it a real "work out"
Just hold the handle down a bit, and let that much more water drop from the top tank.

You can flush with as much as 2.2 gallons that way.

lennym
03-06-2010, 06:05 AM
Terry,

How do you account for the thread in the other forum? You posted to it. Could it be venting?

In any event, if someone has that problem can the Guinevere or Soiree be "tricked" into using 1.6 gallons with an ordinary flick of the lever? A part replacement perhaps? My toilet is going into a guest bathroom.

Thanks.

Terry
03-06-2010, 07:38 AM
How do you account for the thread in the other forum? You posted to it. Could it be venting?



which forum,
There was a real nice post I did on the Guinevere with stats that is no longer there.
The other forums don't let me say much without deleting.
I try to keep it real and honest,
It's funny the posts they do keep.
Most of it is just wild guesses, and then those start getting repeated as fact.

Venting has nothing to do with it.

If the line is not clear, that would make a difference.
Or if there is something in the trapway that slows things down, that matters.
Homeowners always tell me the trap is clear, but when I pull toilets, I find all kinds of things that "weren't there"
They might have been missing those things for a long time, but nobody remembers "placing" them in the bowl.

The world is shifting to 1.28 gallons.
If you need more, hold the handle just a bit longer
Remove the weight that causes the flapper to drop so quick
Replace the flapper with the blue Korky Flapper for Toto.

I've been installing a lot of the 1.28 toilets.
They're out there, and working fine.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_bone_1.jpg

Reader Review
03-14-2010, 01:20 PM
Hi again -
Toilet is working great (so far!) Bathroom looks better, too.
S. Wood
Seattle WA

edbog
03-28-2010, 04:10 PM
Terry:

You've commented on the Soiree and the Guinevere. I'm thinking about installing the Toto Ultrmax II, w/SaniGloss model MS 604164 CEFG. What is your opinion of it? I called Toto and was told the Guinevere is the new name of the Ultramax II but toilets under each of these names are still being sold.

Terry
03-28-2010, 06:32 PM
The MS604114CEFG used to be called the Gwyneth
Now the Ultramax II,
Somewhat modern looking and non-skirted.

The Guinevere and the Soiree are skirted bowl toilets with a traditional look.

All of these have been working very well.

Terry
04-11-2010, 03:26 PM
A nice bathroom with a TOTO Soiree.
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_cabinet.jpg

Elmo
04-16-2010, 07:07 AM
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/thu213.jpg
The handle for the Guinevere
Pretty nice.
Terry, I have 5 Guinevere toilets in my new home. I had a problem where the flapper would not close because the handle, which is normally in the "six O'clock" position would stick in the "3 O'clock" position. This only seemed to happen with the toilets in my 6-year old twins bathrooms. It seems that when they went to flush the toilets they would pull the flush handle not too hard or too soft but just enough to get cause the copper rod to "wedge" against the nut holding the handle to the tank. It took me many tries before I was able to replicate the problem, because it was intermittent, but when I did, I called Toto and they sent me out new handles for all the toilets. Since the new handles were installed, the problem has gone away. Toto says that they never heard of this problem. Have you?

Also, one of the Guinevere toilets would periodically emit a "shrieking" noise when not being used. I fiddled with the float adjustment screw on the fill valve and it stopped the noise but it continues to do this randomly. When I started to research this problem I discovered that of the 5 toilets in the house, this is the only one that is a 1.28GPF model (Green Flush Valve w/white screw) while the others are 1.6GPF (Blue Flush Valve w/no screw). My question is, is there any difference between the 1.28 and 1.6 models besides the flush valves. Can I replace the Green valve with the blue?
Thanks - Great forum

Terry
04-16-2010, 08:49 AM
The china is the same.
They change the fill valve to shut off a bit sooner.
And on some they weight down the flapper to drop quicker.

But, if you overfill the bowl a bit, the extra water finds it's way down the drain.
If the fill valve is making noise while idle, then you may have a leaking flapper.
Fix the flapper, and the noise will go away.
Those fill valves tend to give a little squeak when they shutoff.
Check the flapper for leaks.

jadnashua
04-16-2010, 10:22 AM
The only other thing I can think of is if your water pressure is too high, the weakest point in the system will leak...it could be that flush valve can't handle that high pressure. Have you ever checked yours? You can buy a gauge at one of the big box or plumbing supply houses for about $10 with a max tattle-tale hand. Attach it and leave it on overnight and check the pressure periodically and then the max. If it exceeds 80psi anytime, you need a PRV and an expansion tank, or if you have them, one or the other is bad.

Elmo
04-16-2010, 10:10 PM
The only other thing I can think of is if your water pressure is too high, the weakest point in the system will leak...it could be that flush valve can't handle that high pressure. Have you ever checked yours? You can buy a gauge at one of the big box or plumbing supply houses for about $10 with a max tattle-tale hand. Attach it and leave it on overnight and check the pressure periodically and then the max. If it exceeds 80psi anytime, you need a PRV and an expansion tank, or if you have them, one or the other is bad.

My house water pressure is 70 psi so it is well under the 80 psi threshold.
Thanks anyway for the suggestion. I may just go ahead and change the flapper. I think Terry said to go with one of the Korky flappers after I receive the replacement flush valve from Toto.

Elmo
04-18-2010, 07:07 PM
The china is the same.
They change the fill valve to shut off a bit sooner.
And on some they weight down the flapper to drop quicker.

But, if you overfill the bowl a bit, the extra water finds it's way down the drain.
If the fill valve is making noise while idle, then you may have a leaking flapper.
Fix the flapper, and the noise will go away.
Those fill valves tend to give a little squeak when they shutoff.
Check the flapper for leaks.

Terry, first, thanks very much for the suggestion to use the "blue" Korky flapper. This made a BIG difference in the flush volume and force. The water height in the tank was 6 3/4" which when flushed with the original "orange" Toto flapper would drop to about 3 1/2" in the tank before the flapper would fall and the tank would refill. After switching to the "blue" Korky flapper, the water height in the tank which was still 6 3/4" would then fall to about 2", meaning that an additional 1.5" of water would be used in the flush (whatever that equals in volume). An additional item that I wanted to mention is that the other difference between the 1.6 GPF and 1.28 GPF Toto Guinevere toilets is that the flush valve stand pipe/bowl filler pipe is about 1" taller in the 1.6 GPF toilet. Will I have any issues substituting the "blue" fill valve for the original green fill valve? I never really had an issue with the 1.28 GPF toilet and the blue flapper has made it that much better. I was prepared to put a 1.5" pvc coupling on the fill valve pipe which would provide about the same flush valve height as the 1.6 GPF toilet but it now works so well that I don't think this will be necessary.
Thanks again.

friendlycanuck
04-25-2010, 08:02 PM
Hello we are about to purchase a new toilet and have looked at the Soiree and Guinevere. My questions are:
1. Is this the right choice when water supply is in the floor?
2. Being that there is no Toto dealer in my area, would it be wise to purchase a Toto product? I worry about part supplies when problems arise.

Thanks
Robin

Terry
04-25-2010, 08:09 PM
Parts are simple for a Toto.
Most local hardware stores carry parts for them.
I notice that Korky and Fluidmaster carry replacement 3" flappers, and you can use a variety of fill valves.
You can also order factory replacements.

If your water supply is floor mounted, you would need to measure how far from center it is.
The Soiree and Guinevere have wide foot prints that go pretty close to the wall.

friendlycanuck
04-28-2010, 08:38 AM
Thanks Terry for the reply

We have not run the supply line yet for the toilet as it is a new retrofit. Perhaps this is good...yes, no??

Also, does this toilet have a high water line. Nothing is worse that having to flush twice to clean the bowl above the water line. If not could you recommend a toilet that will flush down messes on bowl.

I have child who tends to use alot of toilet paper, we have pulled our hair out trying to teach her differently, we even have a trash bin next to the toilet for her to use for toilet paper but of course this doesn't always work and we need to unclog the toilet.

Thanks for your help
Robin

Terry
04-28-2010, 09:32 AM
I've sold about 150 of these.
There is less water in the bowl since 1992 in the US.
So unless you find an old 80's bowl, or since you are in Canada, just an old bowl, there is going to be less water.
They do clean pretty well though, at least they keep telling me that.

Peanut9199
04-28-2010, 01:44 PM
Where are you in Northwestern Ontario we have dealers all over?

friendlycanuck
04-29-2010, 06:13 PM
Hello Peanut9199

I am in the Fort Frances area. I really like the look of Soiree Toto toilet but I am not sure if I like the 1.28 gpf. Is it available in the 1.6 gpf in Canada?

Thanks
Robin

Terry
04-30-2010, 07:43 AM
The 1.28 has been working fine. I have one with double cyclone right now.
If you reallly feel you need more rinse, just hold the handle a moment longer.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_bone_1.jpg

Peanut9199
05-05-2010, 12:10 PM
The 1.6 Soiree is no longer available.
I have Soiree's 1.28 liter in my house and have no problems.
The closet i can find to you is Thunder Bay
CRAIG PLUMBING CENTRE
1263 AMBER DRIVE
THUNDER BAY, ONT P7B 6M4
807-345-1137
Almost a 5 hour drive

Terry
06-02-2010, 02:31 PM
Added new picture.
I carry these in Anchorage, Bothell, Seattle, Los Angeles,
http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/guinevere_showroom.jpg
TOTO Guinevere with seat.
Terry Love

lennym
06-03-2010, 08:40 PM
We bought the Soiree about 6 weeks ago partly because I read in this thread that it could be modified to flush with 1.6 gallons if the 1.28 didn't work out. We've had a G-Max Toto Carrollton for 5 years and it's been very effective.

The Soiree at 1.28 gallons has also been absolutely fine so far and has flushed everything we have thrown at it. Like the Carrollton and all modern toilets using less water you can sometimes get a skid mark. But what I have discovered with the Soiree's Sanagloss is that if it's below the waterline it will clean up perfectly by itself with the next flush after a short while.

One thing we appreciate about the double cyclone flush is that there is no normal rim, and no place therefore for dirt to hide under it. It's a cleaner bowl.

Timeo
07-21-2010, 10:10 PM
Does a Washlet S300 fit the Guinevere fine? Any issues with using the S300 and this toilet?

Terry
07-21-2010, 11:29 PM
Any washlet or bidet seat will fit.
There is plenty of space between the seat bolts and the tank.

drfelle
09-02-2010, 07:55 AM
Beautiful toilet and a lot easier to install then most are making it out to be. The hardest part was drilling through the hard porcelain tiles with the 1/4 inch drill bit. Well, it was hard with a dull bit. I went to the hardware store and bought a 5 pack and used 3 of them. The porcelain tile really takes it's toll on concrete bits. Also, I did it WITHOUT a Hammer Drill, but a regular "ac powered" drill. So don't run out and buy/rent one if you don't have it.

If you're worried about the supply being to close, chances are it's not. If your house was built to code you'll be OK. You have a lot more room back there then you think.

Also, thanks to everyone who said this toilet was noisy. I was bracing for the worse when I first flushed the toilet. If the Soiree is noisy, I'm either deaf or have only had really really noisy toilets in the past.

I bought a second Soiree toilet and am anxious to install it.

TWEAK
09-02-2010, 03:04 PM
Beautiful toilet and a lot easier to install then most are making it out to be. The hardest part was drilling through the hard porcelain tiles with the 1/4 inch drill bit. Well, it was hard with a dull bit. I went to the hardware store and bought a 5 pack and used 3 of them. The porcelain tile really takes it's toll on concrete bits. Also, I did it WITHOUT a Hammer Drill, but a regular "ac powered" drill. So don't run out and buy/rent one if you don't have it.

If you're worried about the supply being to close, chances are it's not. If your house was built to code you'll be OK. You have a lot more room back there then you think.

Also, thanks to everyone who said this toilet was noisy. I was bracing for the worse when I first flushed the toilet. If the Soiree is noisy, I'm either deaf or have only had really really noisy toilets in the past.

I bought a second Soiree toilet and am anxious to install it.

I agree... I installed a Guinevere and it isn't really hard at all.

I would be afraid to use a hanmmer drill on tile! Tile is brittle and cracks!

For your second toilet, don't use concrete bits. You can get cheap electrodeposited diamond core drill bits via online suppliers or the popular auction site. These have to be used wet (build a dam out of plumber's putty). These can be had for 5 or 10 bucks, but they are cheapies and will only last 4 or five holes - but FAST and make a clean hole. A good quality diamond core bit will cost more like 20-50 bucks... not worth it for occasional use. Send me a private email and I'll give you the source I use. Not contractor grade, but a good hole for not a lot of $$.

Reader Review
09-05-2010, 10:28 AM
Hello Terry,
 
Hope you had a nice relaxing weekend at the lake, it looked like a great place.
Michael and I installed the Toto Soiree in our main bathroom on Sunday and are very pleased with the look and function, wonderful toilets.

Thanks again,
Carrie M.
Walla Walla WA

Reader Review
09-19-2010, 10:19 AM
Just so you know, your son did a great job. He really cares about his work and worked hard and efficiently. The Toto toilet rocks!
Thanks!
Gary in Seattle

k9
10-27-2010, 05:22 PM
Can somebody tell me the measurement from the back wall to the center of the toto trap hole is for the unifit flange. The hole with the gasket the toilet fits onto.

Im installing another Guinevere and I want to be sure its going to fit.

Thank you

Terry
10-27-2010, 06:11 PM
The standard 12" with the Guinevere will work at 11-1/4" from the wall to center.
A standard rough-in should be 12" from the finished wall, leaving 3/4" behind the tank.

You can also get 10" and 14" adapters if the rough-in is non-standard.

k9
10-27-2010, 10:05 PM
That works, thank you

The standard 12" with the Guinevere will work at 11-1/4" from the wall to center.
A standard rough-in should be 12" from the finished wall, leaving 3/4" behind the tank.

You can also get 10" and 14" adapters if the rough-in is non-standard.

FunNut
11-22-2010, 10:33 PM
We bought the Soiree in Sedona Beige, mainly due to the many favorable comments on this forum. It's been installed for several weeks now and I have to say I absolutely love the toilet. Our plumber put the water line too close to the centerline of the toilet, so we had to move the toilet further out from the wall, but it works fine. The water workings are hidden behind the toilet, it actually looks good. The flush is almost silent and no odd filling noises. Next step is finding just the right bidet seat. Our WC is on the northwest corner of the house and the seat is too cold now that cold weather is here.

We bought a discontinued 1.6 gpf floor model at a plumbing supply store in Santa Fe. It sat in the garage for months before being installed and when we opened the box (they reboxed it for us at the shop) we discovered the unifit parts were missing. The store refused to supply the parts, they literally told us tough luck, "what you see is what you get." My husband got on the phone with Toto Customer Service in Georgia and they sent the parts at no cost and didn't charge for shipping. Excellent customer service is hard to find anymore, so this was an extremely pleasant surprise.

I'm totally sold on Toto and the Soiree looks and performs beyond my expectations.

Terry
11-23-2010, 02:05 PM
I think I've sold over 200 of the Soiree and the Guinevere toilets from Toto. Many of the customers like them very much. It's good to hear about the tech support from Toto. I rarely have ever called them, but it's been a good experience every time.

Terry
02-24-2011, 05:51 PM
Here is an installation of a Toto Soiree in bone, it allows the use of a high bowl, and it fits under a banjo top. That's a tough combination to fit. A tall bowl, and a short counter over the top of the tank.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_bone_1.jpg

Toto Soiree in Bone, Issaquah WA

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_bone_2.jpg

The caulking will turn clear when dry.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/toto_dahl_valve.jpg

If the shutoff is 6" to the left of center you can use the old shutoff, this one was 5" to the left of center, which meant using a Dahl valve designed for the Toto skirted toilets. It's much shorter from the wall.

timcurtin
02-27-2011, 06:34 AM
I saw a post that said -

The standard 12" with the Guinevere will work at 11-1/4" from the wall to center.
A standard rough-in should be 12" from the finished wall, leaving 3/4" behind the tank.

Is this the same for the Soiree?

I want to make sure I have just enough room to wipe down my tile wall if needed with something like a swiffer or something like that.

Thanks,
Tim

Terry
02-27-2011, 11:35 AM
At 12", you will have 3/4" behind the tank.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/soiree_bone_1.jpg

timcurtin
02-28-2011, 10:06 AM
What is the recommendation for drill bit to drill into porcelain tile to install the PVC outlet connection?

jadnashua
02-28-2011, 03:01 PM
You'll have the best luck with a diamond core bit. Depending on what you have available locally, Lowes sells some made by Hitachi that work. Since this type of bit is essentially a piece of pipe with diamond chips on the rim, it takes a little finesse to get the hole where you want it. Also, the things work best if you can keep them cool, so water helps. If you have some plumber's putty, make a little dam around where you want the hole and put some water in it. To start the hole, hold the drill at about a 45-degree angle and then make a divot with the edge. Once you have a divot, slowly raise the drill to vertical keeping the edge in the divot you made. This will keep it from walking all over the place. Once vertical, just keep going. Once you are through the tile and backer, you can switch to a regular drill to go through the wooden subflooring. Keep in mind that this type of bit is grinding the hole, not really cutting it like a wood bit does. I have used a carbide bit, but you may need more than one as carbide and a good, hard porcelain are often about the same hardness. Depends on the tile, some are softer than others. I've never had good luck with a steel or carbide glass bit, but they do make them with diamonds that should work; they work on wall tile, which is often quite soft, but not on a good porcelain.

glnow
03-05-2011, 08:01 PM
Hi,

Question: Does the gap between the wall and back of the tank change when using one of the non-standard uni-fit adapters?

I've had a Guinevere for 4 years, using the 14" UF adapter. For me, the gap is just ~0.2", not 3/4" as listed in the spec sheet. Just wondering if it's because of the adapter or (more likely) my rough-in is only 13.5-ish". The reason I'm wondering now is that the wife would like subway tile on the wall behind the toilet, but there isn't room. I still have the original 12" UF, I'm thinking of using that and just having a bit of a gap with the added tile.

jadnashua
03-05-2011, 08:53 PM
It's likely that your rough-in wasn't exactly 14". You can fudge the position of the toilet on the flange a little bit, but not after you've already drilled the holes for the Unifit. If you substitute the 12" Unifit, the whole toilet will move out 2" from where it is now.

glnow
03-14-2011, 03:42 AM
It's likely that your rough-in wasn't exactly 14". You can fudge the position of the toilet on the flange a little bit...

Thanks! Just so I'm clear, you're referring to fudging the position of the uni-fit on the flange, correct?

The floor tile is being replaced soon, so I'm going to have a chance to re-do the holes for the uni-fit. So this may work. Any idea how much play the uni-fit has on the flange? It's been a while since I installed it so I don't remember what the fit was like.

One last thought, is there a chance that by sliding the uni-fit forward on the flange I risk smearing the wax ring enough to block the drain?

jadnashua
03-14-2011, 03:47 PM
You'd need a new wax ring, as sliding it would likely create a void and therefore a possibility of a leak. You could probably get 1/4", more and it might be a problem getting the screws to hold on the flange.

travelined
05-31-2011, 07:48 PM
Hi gang, one of our Guineveres is off-center in the commode area - is it possible to move these left and right at all? I'd need about 1 1/2" of play to make up the difference. It's really noticeable, since the toilet is 8" from the wall on one side and 11" on the other. It's in the basement level - the floor is slab. Thanks

jadnashua
05-31-2011, 08:18 PM
The toilet can't be moved sideways (or front to back) more than a very small amount (maybe 1/4" if you are lucky) without moving the flange. I'm not sure if that toilet uses the UniFit adapter, if it does, then no, you can't move it even the 1/4" without drilling new holes in the floor. To meet code, the toilet should have 15" on either side of the centerline to any wall or other obstruction.

travelined
06-01-2011, 08:07 AM
thanks - that's what I was afraid of . ..

spitnfire
07-30-2011, 09:52 AM
I think I've sold over 200 of the Soiree and the Guinevere toilets from Toto. Many of the customers like them very much. It's good to hear about the tech support from Toto. I rarely have ever called them, but it's been a good experience every time.

Hi Terry:

Is the sanagloss really worth it? I hear stories that stuff clings to it more or it might stain? How do you clean the sanagloss? Also I hear that some sanagloss may be removed if the wrong cleaner is used and it would make toilet have a yellow hue? Also how are Toto toilets compared with vs Kohler toilets or other toilets?

Terry
07-30-2011, 10:19 AM
I have a bowl with Sanagloss downstairs, installed in 2006. It looks like the day it was installed.
I have a customer in Issaquah that after installing one, changed the rest of his toilets to Sanagloss. He swears by it.

I just use a standard liquid cleaner every once in a while.

If you read comments about "any" new bowl installed since 1992, they will mention the need for some cleaning.
Toilets are now 1.6 or 1.28 with more porcelain surface area, and a lot less water. You have to take those comments with a grain of salt. If you compare an 80's bowl to one from 2011, yes there will be a difference. But if we are comparing "new" toilets to "new" toilets, then it's clear that Sanagloss is the way to go.
I don't sell old bowls, I make sure old bowls are disposed and removed.

The Toto with Sanagloss is a big improvement over the Kohler class five and class six.
It's not even close.
In fact, the Toto without Sanagloss is still a big improvement over Kohler.

spitnfire
07-30-2011, 11:49 AM
is the soiree w/ sanagloss the best non electrical toilet out there? in your opinion.. in terms of function, and durable?

Terry
07-30-2011, 12:49 PM
I don't see how having an electric pump would matter.

I view the Soiree as top of the line.

spitnfire
07-30-2011, 01:09 PM
As a plumber, not a consumer.
According to a plumber on another site about a problem with Toto: Is there any truth to this? Thanks

Every single Toto toilet I installed, I had to return within 2 years and take out/remove the Gmax Fill Valve and replace the original flapper that came with the toilet.


The fill valve is a Korky, aka Hunter fill valve. This company (Toto) is fully aware that they are sending out a fill valve that has a known problem, a $3.47 fix that even the smallest piece of dirt and debri can cause the fill valve to malfunction in these toilets.

Fluidmaster 400A, the fill valve that is now in nearly all name brand toilets is the cure for this problem, not replacing the GMAX fill valve.

Terry
07-30-2011, 01:47 PM
I have a Korky installed over at my mothers home in a Cadet wall hung that has been in use for 15 years.

You can use any fill valve in a Toto; there's plenty of options there.
The Fluidmaster can overfill the bowl, but most plumbers wouldn't care about that. It's water down the drain, which can add to a water bill.
All flappers need replacement at some point. Korky also makes replacement flappers for all toilets. If you are having problems with flappers, then there may be a chlorine tablet in the tank.

We installed a Kohler Memoirs one-piece toilet the other day that was just junk.
The bowl fill alternated between full and party full. Therefore the flush varied between flushes.
The bowl was not even , so sometimes the water line was smaller on the left.
The bottom of the bowl was uneven, so I had to shim on two opposite sides.
Water sprayed on the wall with the tank lid off.
That was a top of the line Kohler product.

I've sold thousands of Toto products over the years, with less then 1% returns. Nobody else can come close to that.
Sanagloss has been a very good product. Like I said in the previous post, the ones in my home look like the day they were installed.
I've been selling Sanagloss since 1998, and they are all in use.

jadnashua
07-30-2011, 01:57 PM
The porcelain in a toilet should last for eons...the plastic and rubber parts certainly won't. As Terry said, the nice thing about Totos is that they use readily available wear parts that are reasonably priced. Try that with some Kohler stuff where it can cost over $100 to replace a worn out part! Depending on your water, the amount of chlorine in it and probably some other things, the rubber parts will degrade over time. That's a fact of life with parts immersed in that soup of chemicals. This is true with most any brand.

As to which Toto is 'the best', it is a two part question: one is subjective, as to how does it look to YOU, the other is by design and execution. Toto has proven to be very well designed and executed. They also don't sit still, and their designs evolve to improve on things, so the toilets that have a II designation are improvements over the original. This is not to say the originals were defective or deficient, it's just that they figured out a way to make it better.

spitnfire
07-30-2011, 05:38 PM
which is better the toto soiree or toto drake or American Standard Traditional Champion 4 ??? and why? What makes the Soiree top of the class as you said?

Terry
07-30-2011, 06:56 PM
The American Standard Champion is not a top choice.

Mostly quality control, but I also don't like the flush as well. There's nothing wrong with it, but the Toto does seem nicer, not so gulpy and sloshy. Getting parts for the Champion has been harder too.

The Drake II will be similar to the other double cyclone products by Toto. It comes with the rinse that spins around the bowl.
The Soiree adds:
one-piece
Skirted bowl
Nicer handle and style (if that's important)

It doesn't work better then the Drake II though.
It's like my SUV. I could have bought one with the same engine and drive train, but I opted for things like electric rear door, keyless locks, 4-wheel drive with traction control. It doesn't go any faster, though it does do a nice job on the road down from Whistler Mountain at 90 MPH on the winding roads.

Quality control.
I don't know what you do for work, but if I have to return items that I've taken the time to install, that's a huge waste of billable time. Save a few bucks, lose hundreds.

spitnfire
07-31-2011, 06:44 AM
Does the Toto Soiree use double cyclone flushing technology or G-max??? What's the difference between the 2 types?
Can you also use a chlorox toilet wand to clean the inside of a sanagloss toilet, will it
cause the sanagloss to come off? How durable is the Sanagloss? How are Fresca toilets? are they any good?
Thanks

Terry
07-31-2011, 11:52 AM
Cleaning isn't an issue with these. Do you have just horrible water where you are?
I sell these for people with bad water.
You don't want to sandpaper them. The idea is to clean them without scratching them. I think it's easy. And I'm a man.

All the the Toto toilets have a similar trapway and a 3" flush valve.

Either the rinse is straight down the bowl, or is spins, (double cyclone)
Both are siphon jet, so that part is essentially the same.

spitnfire
08-03-2011, 12:56 PM
The soiree says it needs at least 8 psi water pressure..., how would I go about measuring
my water pressure for my toilet? it is fine now and with my american standard, it has a strong flush, with
that being said, do you think i need to go to home depot to buy a water pressure guage to measure
my pressure?

Terry
08-03-2011, 01:47 PM
The only way the pressure would be at 8 PSI is if you collect water from the roof and gravity feed your home.

I assume you can shower?

Terry
08-10-2011, 01:47 PM
This looks nice in a log cabin.
hj, this also meets the ADA requirements.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms874_log_cabin.jpg

Gary Swart
08-10-2011, 03:14 PM
I question the comment that the Soiree needs 8 psi to flush. Toilets other than pressure assisted (which Toto does not make at all) require zero pressure to flush. Toilets flush from the water in the tank. Normal household water pressure can vary a great deal, but should run from as low as 30 psi to 60 psi. If it is higher, a pressure regulator valve should be installed. Obviously to refill the tank, there must be some pressure in the water system, but 8 psi is not even close to normal.

jadnashua
08-10-2011, 03:17 PM
8psi may not be enough to close the flush valve, but if it did, there would be no difference in the flush whether the pressure was 8 or 80psi. Above that 80psi, the valve may have difficulty staying closed (and that value is considered the top of 'normal' - above that you should install a reduction valve).

spitnfire
08-10-2011, 03:31 PM
Can I use lysol , chlorox wand to clean Soiree with sanagloss, it says to use dishwasher liquid, but is lysol and chlorox wand ok? and wont damage the sanagloss. thanks

spitnfire
08-14-2011, 11:25 AM
I had a plumber come out to install my toto soiree,
I asked him if I needed a new wax ring, he said no, that's the 1st thing he
inspects, he used the original one that came from the old toilet - it's a new house,
so the wax ring is probably 1&1/2 years old, he said I didn't need a new one, old
one was in good condition and if any problems or leaks he will come back.

2nd thing he said was that my old toilet may be better than the toto b/c it does not
use a pvc outlet connection, which he said might clog or break and it's made out of
some type of plastic - any issues with these in the past vs a standard toilet which doesn't
have one?

3rd, can I use lysol, clorox wand, and fantastic on the sanagloss? Is it safe?

Thanks,

spitnfire
08-14-2011, 11:37 AM
Should I call the plumber back to re-do the install with a new wax ring?
And if it is only 1 & 1/2 yr old, do you think it will suffice?

Thanks

jadnashua
08-14-2011, 01:02 PM
Was the wax ring new, but sitting around in a box, or already used? If it was used, it was already smushed down to seal the old toilet, and it's unlikely the new one is sealed properly. Any plumber worth his salt would never reuse an already used wax ring.

If plastic in itself was going to create a clog, 10's of millions of houses would have a problem, as that's what most of the drain pipes are made of. By using the UniFit adapter, Toto can make the bends exactly like they want and have them come out nice and smooth. You cannot do that in porcelain. So, the plumber was blowing smoke...

The instructions that come with the Toto tell you what you should use. Did the plumber leave you them? Have you looked at them?

spitnfire
08-14-2011, 04:01 PM
He's a plumber he said since 1988, and he said that he gives a 5 to 10 yr warranty that it wont leak,
he said if it does, just call him and he'll come back and redo.
No the rings were used about 1 & 1/2 yr old, he just reused the old wax ring, from the old toilet, he said it
was in a good condition. Should I make him come back and redo it?

And in regards to sanagloss, is it ok to use lysol, fantastik, clorox wand?

Thanks


Was the wax ring new, but sitting around in a box, or already used? If it was used, it was already smushed down to seal the old toilet, and it's unlikely the new one is sealed properly. Any plumber worth his salt would never reuse an already used wax ring.

If plastic in itself was going to create a clog, 10's of millions of houses would have a problem, as that's what most of the drain pipes are made of. By using the UniFit adapter, Toto can make the bends exactly like they want and have them come out nice and smooth. You cannot do that in porcelain. So, the plumber was blowing smoke...

The instructions that come with the Toto tell you what you should use. Did the plumber leave you them? Have you looked at them?

jadnashua
08-14-2011, 05:57 PM
You should have gotten a copy of this with the toilet... http://www.totousa.com/Portals/0/BrochureDownloads/0GU016-2.pdf If you have further questions, I suggest you call Toto.

The only way I can see the (slight) possibility of reusing a wax ring when a toilet was removed is if it wasn't compressed, and thus wasn't making a good seal in the first place. And, if that was the case, the flange is likely not installed properly (i.e., on top of the finished floor and anchored through it into the subflooring).

Terry
08-14-2011, 11:51 PM
He's been plumbing that long and doesn't use new parts?
And he's confused about the new products?

Have him call me. I would love to talk to him. It's not every day you get to meet a novice like that.

spitnfire
08-15-2011, 04:54 AM
It's been installed for about a week, everything seems fine, there is no water coming out at base of toilet,
so do you think I should still replace the wax or trust the plumber??, he guaranteed nothing will happen in
the next 10 years or he'll come back and fix. Or will you only see problems when the toilet clogs?
Is the plumber that lazy that he reused the old wax because he didnot want to clean the old one and put
in a new one?

Terry
08-15-2011, 08:47 AM
I would guess that it's fine, it's just so funny that your plumber is so cheap.
Did he also reuse the water supply line? Of course he did.
We always use new bolts and nuts, new wax and new supply lines. Duh!

spitnfire
08-16-2011, 02:49 AM
Yes he did reuse the supply lines, it looks pretty new, only 1 and 1/2 yrs old.
So do you think there would be no problems with it b/c there has not been
after more than a week of use??? Will the problem only come up if the toilet is clogged???
Should I make him come back and put in new wax?
Sorry to sound like a novice, I didn't know any better but to trust the plumber
whose considerably older and supposedly a master plumber,
because I never changed a toilet and I'm young and naive.


I would guess that it's fine, it's just so funny that your plumber is so cheap.
Did he also reuse the water supply line? Of course he did.
We always use new bolts and nuts, new wax and new supply lines. Duh!

jadnashua
08-16-2011, 11:21 AM
If the toilet does not rock and when he installed the parts on the flange he had to compress it to smush the wax, then it probably did make a good seal. Hassle is, generally, that wax has already been smushed to conform to the old toilet, and it isn't a spring! If the new one has less room, there may be enough left to smush some more and make a seal.

Because the outlet of the toilet is sort of a funnel, unless there's a gap AND the line gets backed up, you won't get water/waste leaks. But, if there's a gap, you will get sewer gas leaks and maybe ants, sewer flies, etc. sneaking out of there and under the toilet. If it doesn't smell, rock, or leak...it's probably okay.

lennym
08-23-2011, 10:19 AM
I've had the Soiree for about 14 months, having read the reviews on this site, and it is an amazingly good performer. Recently, though, we've had a problem with the flapper. After being away from the house for a month the flapper didn't make a seal. The end furthest from its connection to the white pipe kind of ducks into the hole and the toilet runs on and on. You have to put your hand in to lift it to get it to seal. Funny thing is that after a few flushes, it began to operate normally. But then we went away for a weekend and the problem, and solution, repeated. Strange. I called Toto and they're sending me a new flapper. But is that likely to happen again next year?

jadnashua
08-23-2011, 12:04 PM
It depends entirely on the quality and composition of your water...in my house, the flapper lasts about 4-5 years...I've heard some where it lasts 10, and others only a year or two. Also, do NOT put any of the toilet cleaner devices/tablets into the tank as that will kill the flapper very quickly. If the dome starts to get sucked down into the valve seat and the rim is no longer staying flat, it's time to think about replacing it before it leaks.

lennym
08-23-2011, 04:56 PM
Thanks for the response. We have NYC water which is really very good, good enough to filter and sell as bottled water which is actually done. I use no cleaner of any sort. The toilet doesn't need any. I have had a Toto Carrollton upstairs for about 7 years without a problem. Perhaps just a bad flapper this time. The Soiree does get more use than any other toilet in the house. But funny how it "fixes" itself.

Gary Swart
08-23-2011, 05:36 PM
You can buy a new flapper for just a few dollars and it takes only a couple of minutes to change it. If that is not the problem, you will have invested very little and will have at least verified that the flapper is not the problem. My guess: It's the flapper. Either the water quality or perhaps just a early demise of the flapper.

lennym
08-24-2011, 05:38 AM
Well, what do you know. They have actually changed the design of the flapper. Toto sent me a replacement. It now has three little ridges on the top at the far end, evidently to stiffen that part of the flapper that was dragged into the valve seat. Hope to get more than a year out of this one.

The flapper that came out was noticeably curled up at that end. A design defect? Too much water in the tank? The water comes to within 1/2 inch of the top of the white tube. Is that where it is supposed to be?

jadnashua
08-24-2011, 02:11 PM
FWIW, Toto does not make the fill valves or the flappers that they supply with their toilets although they are made to their specs for them. While they have several suppliers, the majority are made for them by Korky. In the scheme of things, one hopes things get incremental or evolutionary improvements - that may be one of them. Only time will tell.

Gary Swart
08-24-2011, 05:18 PM
I don't think it matters how high the water is in the tank, only the set amount will be released on the first flush. If you opt for a the "big gulp", the tank will empty so that could be more than the standard flush. On a positive side of that, if the tank has a bit more water, then the possibility of condensation is reduced as the water remaining in the tank will temper the cold incoming a little more than typical. Your post has reminded me to pick up a couple of extra flappers to have on hand, so thank you for that!

dinkledoodle
08-27-2011, 06:00 AM
Oops! Not a pleasant experience yesterday. First, the plumber sent out by my "Silver rated" Toto dealer couldn't figure out how to install the toilet. He got all the way to dropping the cone into the adapter and couldn't make it fit in. He said it wouldn't fit because there wasn't enough space to the wall and I needed to strip the tile off the wall. After he left (with a $155 check), and I got over my shock and removed the bottom 6 tiles, I tried to seat the toilet and found I was having the same problem. Then the answer came to me.... Press down. With a little pressure the cone slipped into the adapter as smooth as silk. The 2 hours I'd spent stripping tiles off a 40 year mortar bed was totally unnecessary. So, why am I still unhappy. Check out the video. I know these toilets are super flushers. What's wrong with mine? And what's with that pathetic gargling at the end of the flush. I know I'm missing something pretty obvious but, frankly, I'm exhausted and my brain just ain't functioning. Thanks in advance, guys...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5bmjFl0Svs

Terry
08-27-2011, 09:46 AM
Pull the tank lid cover off and make sure that the refill tube from the fill valve is pointed down the overflow tube.
This is what refills the bowl.

If the bowl is not full at the beginning, then the flush from the tank only fills the bowl, it doesn't flush the bowl.

I'm sorry that you installer was clueless.

Yes, you install the adapter with wax, bolts and screws to the floor.
And then you drop the bowl onto that. Most homeowners figure that out pretty easily.
It's too bad that many plumbers don't read the instructions. The paperwork that comes with the toilet shows how much room is behind the tank with a standard 12" rough. You don't have to guess at this.
At 12", you should have 3/4" behind the tank.

The next step after "reading" that, is to use a "tape measure"
The two tools your plumber should have used were

"reading glasses"
"tape measure"

The rest is common sense.

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/ms974_inside_tank.jpg

http://www.terrylove.com/wc/toto/flange_03.jpg
An adapter installed on tile using the green inserts and the screws that come in the Unifit Box.

dinkledoodle
08-27-2011, 12:25 PM
Thank you Terry. Sorry for the vent, but as I said I was just tired. This is how he attached the refill tube. It isn't the overflow, but it does point down it. And as you see there is still no flush. Oh well... (p.s. It was the 10" adapter.)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab0-WxeAeYc

jadnashua
08-27-2011, 12:51 PM
Owning a couple of similar Totos, what you are seeing is not normal. It looks like you probably have a drain line obstruction or, when they installed the adapter, they blocked part of the drain with the wax.

dinkledoodle
08-27-2011, 02:21 PM
I'm thinking so too Jim. There was wax oozing out all around the adapter. I never see that in Terry's pictures. We plan to call the company Monday.

dinkledoodle
08-28-2011, 09:08 AM
Arrrrrrgh! You're not going to believe this. I walked in this morning, gave it a pity flush and voila! Flushed perfectly. What did I do? Absolutely nothing! I have no idea what happened. It was a miracle... I have a self-healing toilet... :)

jadnashua
08-28-2011, 12:53 PM
It's possible that you have a partial drain line blockage, and that overnight, it drained down so there was plenty of room for the waste water to go. It sounds like it's not the toilet at all, and a drain line problem.

Terry
09-01-2011, 09:20 AM
The Soiree and the Guinevere need the water supply 6" to the left of center.
Most toilets can get by with 3" to the left of center.

I used to plumb the water at six inches anyway, so it's not normally an issue.

http://www.terrylove.com/images/toto_guinevere_ultramax_bac.jpg

glnow
09-12-2011, 12:58 PM
Random question.

Are current Guineveres, or other Totos that make use of the uni-fit, still prone to a dripping sound
as soon as waste enters the bowl?

All of the threads that talk about this are a few years old, and there was some speculation back then that Toto was going to change the plastic, or add a coating, or something to address the dripping sound. Just curious if that ever ended up happening?

jadnashua
09-12-2011, 01:55 PM
Mine are the older ones (no idea if they really changed them), and the sound is so subtle, once you understand what it is, it goes into the background noise like the furnace blower, ticking clocks, wind, etc. It really isn't a big deal. All toilets do this, but not many have some plastic in the drain line. The addition of those liquids or solids make more noise than the overflow going down the drain, and it equilizes shortly after those stop.

glnow
09-12-2011, 02:22 PM
Mine are the older ones (no idea if they really changed them), and the sound is so subtle, once you understand what it is, it goes into the background noise like the furnace blower, ticking clocks, wind, etc. It really isn't a big deal. All toilets do this, but not many have some plastic in the drain line. The addition of those liquids or solids make more noise than the overflow going down the drain, and it equilizes shortly after those stop.

Yeah I got used to it a long time ago, though it still gets annoying explaining exactly what you said above to visitors when they tell me I have a leak (can u believe, not everyone in the world reads toilet forums! I mean come on, what's wrong with these people :p ). I just got to wondering if Toto ever did anything about it, maybe with the 1.2 flush versions, for example.

Marie Koch
02-03-2014, 10:13 AM
But you never caulk all the way around as that would mask a leak from the toilet draining, right?



Wax between the adapter and the floor flange is what seals the sewer gas.

The caulk is to prevent water from going under the bowl from the front.

The Soiree and the Guinevere should come with a 12" adapter in the box.
I have no idea why there would be a 10"
Sometimes for various reasons we will install them with a 10" though.

wjcandee
02-03-2014, 12:18 PM
But you never caulk all the way around as that would mask a leak from the toilet draining, right?

Depends on the jurisdiction. In Terry's area, they leave the back open. Here in my jurisdiction, they want it all the way around.

homehunter808
03-02-2014, 12:20 PM
I have 3 Soirees in my house. The flush is fantastic, the bowl-clean is very good. My only complaint, other than the sound effects, is that the bowl shape is such that there's quite a bit of splash-back when women use it. Since there are no men in my household, I have to remember to clean the underside of the seat frequently. Very frequently. Surely they could engineer a shape that doesn't cause so much splash. I never had this issue with my UltraMax/GMax or any other brand of toilets.