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FatsoPilot
08-16-2012, 10:25 PM
I paid a professional plumber to do the DWV rough-in for my basement. Does this look right? Should I be concerned about all the turns and possible future clogging with my toilet? It basically does a 360 to join back in to the old cast iron. If it is alright any idea on how I can get 4 more inches of clearance off the back wall (the wall with the main stack in it)? I don't see a way of doing it without throwing out $40 in parts, I can't cut in anywhere and put in a coupler and I can't get around the vent in front of it to bring it away from the wall. I was all ready to lay cement unit I measured and saw how far off the toilet drain is, so I dug it back up and now I'm having second thoughts on the whole layout. Thanks in advance for any advice/help.

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hj
08-17-2012, 06:54 AM
It MIGHT have been the only way to do it, but since all of the old piping is covered up, we cannot tell if there was a better spot to make the connection. He should NOT have used a "Fernco" type coupling to make the finall connection, however, IF your area only allows them underground OUTSIDE the building. I would be more concerned about the shower drain, if that is what it is, because, unless it has an individual vent, it is NOT vented the way it is installed. A shower vent could vent the toilet, but the toilet vent CANNOT vent the shower.

mikeplummer
08-17-2012, 09:30 AM
this looks far from professional

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 10:09 AM
It MIGHT have been the only way to do it, but since all of the old piping is covered up, we cannot tell if there was a better spot to make the connection. He should NOT have used a "Fernco" type coupling to make the finall connection, however, IF your area only allows them underground OUTSIDE the building. I would be more concerned about the shower drain, if that is what it is, because, unless it has an individual vent, it is NOT vented the way it is installed. A shower vent could vent the toilet, but the toilet vent CANNOT vent the shower.

That is the old shower drain (you can see I've taken it off in the 2nd and 3rd pictures above), I'm turning it into a general drain for the basement. Here is the cast iron before we started:

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You can see the old toilet on the right which is where we broke into. The vent for the basement is the copper on the upper right corner. I can extend out from the old cast iron if necessary and keep the current setup which will give me the required clearance for my toilet. I'm mainly concerned about toilet clogging issues with the current setup. Thanks again.

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 10:10 AM
this looks far from professional


He told me he has been a plumber for 35 years and has done 1000's of basement DWV systems. What about it looks unprofessional? What would you change?

jadnashua
08-17-2012, 10:25 AM
There's a limit on how much a drain line can turn before a cleanout is required (and I think you've exceeded it). With all of those angles, it is going to slow things down and it would be a bear to impossible to snake, should it ever become necessary.

Was a permit pulled? Was it inspected and passed?

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 10:43 AM
I didn't get a permit, I wasn't planning on getting one but I am looking into it now.

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 11:55 AM
Didn't the professional plumber get the permit? He's the one that should have pulled it and called for inspection. It's illegal to plumb without a permit and he could be fined for doing so.

From the posts above my suspicion is that the work was not done by a licensed plumber in the first place and if that's so I don't see the point in blaming crappy work and making the plumbing trade look bad.

I'm not sure what you are hinting at, the plumber has his license listed as GERLAP8897MQ. It either sounds like you are calling me a liar or saying that this plumber that I paid isn't actually licensed. I'm asking for advice here (of which you've added nothing to the conversation except peanut gallery type remarks), not trying to make the plumbing profession look bad. I didn't get a permit and the plumber didn't insist on a permit.

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 12:27 PM
there are no licensed plumbers in wa state with that license number.

I'm not sure what you are trying to prove, it is listed as gerlap*897mq and they are listed as a licensed contractor with a plumbing speciality. I'm really just looking for advice on what I should do, I'm not trying to get into an argument with anyone on whether the plumber I used is licensed or not.

Hotbacon
08-17-2012, 12:49 PM
I have nothing of real value to add, aside from the fact that I'm a total novice at plumbing and can see this spiral drain would cause issues.

For Tom, here's a craigslist ad for a plumber in Spokane with that plumbing license: http://spokane.craigslist.org/sks/3174449956.html

jadnashua
08-17-2012, 01:44 PM
There are no licensed plumbers in WA state with that license number.

What he was trying to say (I think anyway), is that he checked, and that number isn't valid. Doesn't mean he isn't saying it is, it's just that it isn't currently a valid number! He may have lost it, or he may never have had one, or who knows what. A call to the county and you can verify that yourself. I can say I'm a brain surgeon, that doesn't make me one.

I'm no expert, but from what I (think) I know, that would NOT pass code or an inspection. Code is a MINIMUM implementation; I don't think he met that level.

Terry
08-17-2012, 02:04 PM
I deleted a few of the Tom Sawyer posts.

The layout looks awkward to those of us that take pride in plumbing.
Could it have been done better? Yes
With less bends? Yes
Like hj, I would have liked to have seen a shielded coupling in place of the rubber Fernco.
Could the rough In been closer to the wall? I would think so.
To be fair, it was a bit of a challenge there. Like hj, I would have considered cutting out the old and starting new.


A shower vent could vent the toilet, but the toilet vent CANNOT vent the shower.
hj

I also wonder where that other pipe is going before the vent for the toilet. Is that a new shower? If so, it should be vented between the p-trap and where it enters the main line, downstream of the toilet.

FatsoPilot
08-17-2012, 02:52 PM
Thank you for the reply, it is much appreciated. The other pipe exiting the bottom of the image is a 2" run going to a shower and a tub both of which were vented separately.

Tom Sawyer
08-17-2012, 03:51 PM
Was not trying to bust the guys hump but if he paid a licensed plumber to do the job then he got screwed and should be going after the plumber rather than having to try and fix the mess himself and have to spend more money. I'll go back to my earlier post though and reiterate that to do what he wants done properly, more if not most of the old cast needs to be torn out and re-routed which is what 90% of experienced plumbers would do rather than the mess he has there. Sorry if you all thought I was bagging on him, not my intention.

hagakure
08-17-2012, 04:05 PM
A 90 degree turn should be done using a wye and 45 with a cap at the end for a cleanout and since you're in the basement, put it right there in the floor.

Copper vent? Is it even big enough to vent everything you're doing? Does it tie into a larger vent not made of copper? If so, use it for something else or scrap it for $2.50 lb.

And just for future reference, I'd be wary of craigslist posters even if they do have websites. This goes for more than just professional service offers. This is from personal experience..

..I have a problem.


I'm not sure what you are hinting at, the plumber has his license listed as GERLAP8897MQ. It either sounds like you are calling me a liar or saying that this plumber that I paid isn't actually licensed. I'm asking for advice here (of which you've added nothing to the conversation except peanut gallery type remarks), not trying to make the plumbing profession look bad. I didn't get a permit and the plumber didn't insist on a permit.

Though his mind is not for rent

Don't put him doown as arrogant.

hj
08-18-2012, 08:36 AM
That last picture shows just enough to be "intriguing". it appears to be a "Y", 45, tee or Y, and another tee "backwards" into that fitting, which also creates a "loop". What is that connection for? If THAT mishmash had been removed and redone, I am sure the toilet's connection would have been much simpler. For anything other than a floor drain branch, a cleanout is "required" after every 90 degrees which means your setup would have needed THREE cleanouts assuming there was room for them, which there is not.

Tom Sawyer
08-18-2012, 08:57 AM
So HJ, am I off base to suggest that whoever plumbed that mess has no clue what he's doing?

FatsoPilot
08-18-2012, 12:00 PM
A 90 degree turn should be done using a wye and 45 with a cap at the end for a cleanout and since you're in the basement, put it right there in the floor.

Copper vent? Is it even big enough to vent everything you're doing? Does it tie into a larger vent not made of copper? If so, use it for something else or scrap it for $2.50 lb.


The copper vent is 2 inches.

FatsoPilot
08-18-2012, 12:07 PM
That last picture shows just enough to be "intriguing". it appears to be a "Y", 45, tee or Y, and another tee "backwards" into that fitting, which also creates a "loop". What is that connection for? If THAT mishmash had been removed and redone, I am sure the toilet's connection would have been much simpler. For anything other than a floor drain branch, a cleanout is "required" after every 90 degrees which means your setup would have needed THREE cleanouts assuming there was room for them, which there is not.

That last picture was the original plumbing when I dug it up. There was a sink that drained into the copper vent and down through the toilet line. I've had someone else come look at it and they are going to break into the mainline and take out all the old cast iron, properly place the toilet rough-in, take out all the old work and put in a backwater valve. I'll post pictures when it is done. I'll see what the original guy says when I tell him I had to pay someone else to redo all the work. Thanks for all the advice.

Tom Sawyer
08-19-2012, 11:36 AM
Now there you go, you go after the guy that ripped you off in the first place. Before you do the backwater valve, make sure you check with the city or town because sometimes they don't like them installed without their knowledge.

FatsoPilot
08-28-2012, 02:48 PM
Here is the new layout for the basement rough-in:

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Tom Sawyer
08-28-2012, 03:04 PM
I don't know where to start except to say no. That was done by a plumber too?

FatsoPilot
08-30-2012, 12:15 PM
Terry, HJ,

Do you see any issue with this setup?

Tom Sawyer
08-30-2012, 12:40 PM
Everythings wrong with it. There's no vent for the shower or the toilet and whatever that line is coming in after the toilet, if it's a vent then it's flat and not to code and if its part of a wet vent it's on the wrong end of the toilet and the shower drain is a 3/4 s trap with no vent and the top picture has no toilet vent and the list goes on and on. Nothing there meets code really.
whoever is doing the work has no clue about proper venting or plumbing practices either for that matter and you can get all pissed off at me if you want but I'm trying to save you money, time and headaches down the road. You can do it right or you can do it again and again and again.

FatsoPilot
08-30-2012, 03:44 PM
The line after the toilet is a wet vent line (for the laundry sink and the bath sink) which will tie back in to the old copper vent. How could a vent be on the wrong end of a toilet, I'm not following, it is downstream? The drain to the left of the toilet is not vented, it is a basement general drain, not a shower drain (that is why it has the primer line). The drains in the top picture are a bath drain and shower drain, both of which are vented, the lines run to the left wall in the picture.

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Tom Sawyer
08-30-2012, 07:13 PM
The laundry sink can not be used as any part of the wet vent system. Only bath group fixtures can be wet vented. That line should also have been before the toilet so that the toilet wye is washed by the fixture(s) above. The floor drain is not vented and the way the fittings are laid up you have created an s trap there. Where does that horizontal that is above the floor drain wye go?