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bmfc1
12-20-2005, 04:03 PM
I am on my third Kohler Cimarron Comfort Height toilet. We decided to replace an old American Standard that was in my son's bathroom and was clogging every week. My plumber recommended the Kohler Cimarron. The first one he put in was the round seat. 2 hrs after it was installed it clogged! My son was able to plunge it. We called the plumber who was shocked. The next day my husband tried the toilet, not only did it clog it flooded the bathroom! We were not able to un clog it.The next morning we saw that the flood had caused our kitchen ceiling to buckle! The plumber had to come and snake the toilet.We decided that we had a dud. The plumber could not replace it until the Kohler rep got back to him which took a week. Well we then got toilet # 2( same toilet).
We decided not to fix the ceiling until we were sure that the toilet worked. Well it was good for a week and then yup another un-plungable clog! Plummer came back snaked again and this time we got an upgrade - the elongated bowl. Kohler decided that the whole batch at the plumbing supply store must have been bad. Still not fixing the ceiling yet. Well # 3 is going on a week and a half and tonight - yup you guessed it - clogs again! We were able to plunge it.
I am at wits end - I don't know what to do. This toilet was sold as one I would never have to plunge.
I am calling the plumber back tomorrow but I don't know what to do. Do I ask for a better model? If so which one? Have you ever heard of anything like this?

jadnashua
12-20-2005, 05:04 PM
Lots of old plumbing names out there that haven't figured out out how to make a good low-flow toilet...they are living on their (failing) reputations. Terry has a test report on toilet performance you can find and read up on the performance of various brands and models; I think it was done by California.

Ask for a Toto with gmax...while nothing is ever foolproof, those are pretty good - highly recommended. Go over to the http://www.totousa.com website and look them over after you read the reports and get some recommendations. I personally like the looks of the skirted versions - I've got a Vespin and a Carlyle in my home. Note, I'm not a pro, nor do I sell these things.

plumber1
12-20-2005, 06:50 PM
Here we go again, another darn poor quality, high price Kohler situation.

achutch
12-21-2005, 05:38 AM
I tried the Cimarron too (bypassing the AS Champion based on user comments), and had it just over a year. It was a disappointment. It clogged once and needed a plunger, and clogged several times, but another flush dislodged it without needing a plunger. The bowl rinse was totally unacceptable because only a small trickle of water came down the sides. I should have heeded that warning too, but spent $200+ to give it a try.

After returning home after closing my camp for the season and once again having to deal with a poor flush, I decided I had enough and switched to the Toto Drake ADA model based on information from this site, and have been extremely pleased. The Cimarron was sent to "The Reuse Zone" where it may or may not be making someone else's life miserable.

With the Drake, my second floor most heavily used toilet is now on par with my 3 antique beauties that flush perfectly: ("Standard" MODERNUS 1936 in downstairs half bath, and at my summer home now closed for winter season, Gerber (no model name on bowl) 1952, and "Standard" TIFFIN 1926), and I would highly recommend the Drake to anybody.

My father is so impressed by my Drake that he hinted for one. He'll be getting one for Christmas to replace his 1985 American-Standard PLEBE (though I won't try to wrap it)!!

Hope you get your problem solved.

Matt

plumber1
12-21-2005, 07:07 AM
I realize we have to conserve water. Probably part of Kohlers problem is they couldn't engineer a good water saver toilet. But I remember this point from the 60s when we had to suffer through EARTH DAY. Put bricks in your toilet tank and save a little water. The cost for that was plumbers made more service calls to unplug the toilet. At that same time I noticed that the Kohler Wellworth toilet of the 1930s and 40s could flush with a little more than a half a tank of water. I believe that if they lowered the height of the overflow on that toilet, it would flush better than their water saver of today.

Now if we really want to conserve water why didn't we start saving water that is used for sprinkler systems? Leaks that are unattended to and over watering to the point of thousands of gallons running down the road looking for a drain. Oh no make us all deal with water saver toilets with smaller traps and outlets. Flush two or three times. Call the plumber. Get poor excuces.

Those complaints are less now, but when are we going to do something about all the water we waste on lawns of all kinds, commerical and residential . Even under ground....

Snowman
12-22-2005, 01:21 PM
Sorry to get off topic for just a second... :(


Then, a wise older woman told the facts. I am threat to married women. Women I have known for years. She told me, that it happens most of the time with a few, and she added that it does not help that I look the way I do.

Well, darn...... I guess you will just have to start acting your age..... Just kidding, Cookie.......... What a nice complement in disguise. ;)

Merry Christmas, Cookie... Tom

Terry
12-27-2005, 11:20 AM
You've got to keep the boots, but why not the mini-skirt?

Yeah I know, styles are changing. The Gaucho things are coming in I guess.

bmfc1
01-01-2006, 11:15 AM
Thanks to all. We are still having problems with this toilet. We were on vacation so we were not able to do anything. We got back on Friday night and on Sat.
the toilet clogged twice! Both plungeable. My husband is starting to think that it's a problem with our kids (too much fiber?) or the pipes. I don't know about the kids but I would assume that the pipes are fine as my master bath toilet is right on the other side of the wall and it works OK. It is an old American Standard model, and it will clog occasionally but nothing like the new Kohler.

Could this be a pipe problem or is this Kolher just a piece of junk?

I am going to have the plumber remove it and put in a Toto.

plumber1
01-01-2006, 01:49 PM
Back in the days when the Kohler Wellworth was a decent toilet I had a customer who's Wellworth toilet off the kitchen plugged up and I just augured it. I made another call there for the same thing. The lady of the house said that it happened after their 13 year old daughter was in there. Then I asked the lady to ask her daughter to use a different toilet. A week or so later I had another call there and a different toilet was plugged by the daughter. I suggested she have her daughter break it up with a stick. The customer later called and said that everything's ok now.