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Greg K
11-01-2004, 04:51 PM
I just installed the American Standard Champion toilet. The first problem that I had (and still have) is the fact that the tank can not be seated on the support flanges at the rear. The tank does lean forward a bit. The problem is cause by mainly by the stiffness of the large rubber tank/bowl seal. I have tried to tighten the hold down bolts in a number of different ways, but to no avail. I then had to replace the bolt washer seal because it got pulled down to deep and torned. AS uses a Tee shape gasket/washer with a sleeve for the bolts. I replaced them with a thicker standard rubber washer. I did replaced the bottom length of the sleeve of the original gasket back in the tanks holes so as to protect the china from the side of the bolts.

As for the banging flush tower during the flush, I found that the best way to minumize the bang, is to hold the flush lever handle with the palm of your right hand then gently push the handle down only half way down and then hold it there for a moment. As it flushes, bring the handle back up slowly as you still hold it. In this way, the tower will stay engaged to the lift clips located within the center of the tower. If you push the flush handle with a fast release action, the tower will rise to high... disengage from the clips and drop like a rock. This technique takes a little practice. Remember, it is best if you palm the handle so that you have control of the force you apply.

I may try another idea of installing a thick round foam pipe insulation tube to the inside top of the tank cover. This will act as a cushion for the pull bar in the tank. When you push the handle down, it will prevent the bar from rising to high. It is hope that this modification will work when your house guest flushes the toilet in the normal fast push and release of the handle way.

I am now happy with the unit after this change of flushing habit. I only wish I was able to get the standard height toilet. The right height is to high for me!!!

Greg K

dc_homeplumber
11-04-2004, 07:59 PM
I offer this information after the fact, Greg, but although the Champion was initially offered only in the taller ADA model, you can now get it in the standard height in three different models: a two piece with elongated bowl, a two piece with a standard round bowl and a new one piece with elongated bowl.

Greg K
11-05-2004, 08:58 PM
I only when to the Home Depot to buy the Champion. The store only had a few right height unit in stock. I just thought that the right height would of been lower then ADA requirement but a bit highter then a standard seat height. I am 5'-7" high but I can just touch the floor when seated.

Greg

JnoKimble
12-18-2004, 04:21 AM
I really wish I had known about this site prior to buying the AS Champion. DO NOT BUY THIS TOILET if you don't want to worry yourself sick waiting for something else to go wrong.
Granted, it is hard to beat at what it is supposed to do, but it simply is not worth all the problems. In my opinion, AS released this toilet way too early, and should have done much more testing.
I hope all you guys who believe the new design stops your leak between the tank and bowl are happy, because you may be in for a big surprise. I have had the new tank style since I bought it the first of November. The tank to bowl fitting really sucks (I should say rocks). I even tightened it until I was afraid it would break. Worked about a week and is now back to rocking. Any thoughts?
Walked by the bathroom yesterday and heard water running, then quit, then run, then quit, and yep, you got it, the Champion had developed a slow leak allowing water to run into the bowl from the tank, and thus have more water run into the bowl and then quit and then start back again. I wonder how much water this thing would waste if you were on a two week vacation, and it started running like this.
One of the main reasons I replaced 12 year old toilets with AS was to stop the leaking around the flapper. Boy, give me my flapper back, please!
Hopefully, I can get my money back from Lowes. My hacks cleaned out my garage of the trash left behind, including the receipts, so I have to see if I can get another one, I guess.
Like the Edsel; remember those?; the Champion, I think was way ahead of its time, and I think, if I can get my money back, I will buy another old fashioned toilet and simply "sit and wait", if you know what I mean!

gaw
12-04-2005, 10:31 PM
I've updated the repair procedure for the American Standard champion. The procedure resolves the leaking flush seal issue, as well as the "clunk."

I hate that it had to take such drastic remedies, but American Standard has provided ZERO support. This is a last resort remedy, but I finally have a toilet I can be happy to own.

Repair procedure can be found here (http://unitelater.com/s9y/index.php?/archives/132-Disclaimer.html) .

master plumber mark
12-05-2005, 04:00 AM
I went to your site to re-build the
champoin toilet...

now that really looks like a fun time
actually makeing special parts and all......


maybe their is going to be a secondary market
for repair parts to that piece of junk and someone
could get rich...but its doubtful....


it seems for all the trouble you went through,
and anything else that might crop up with those new
self-styled parts, and the time and suffering--ect

would it have just been better to have taken the
damn thing and thrown it out on the front lawn then gone out
and got an Eljer?????

or is that option still being considered if this attempt fails??

gaw
12-05-2005, 09:23 AM
I cannot tell you the amount of pain and suffering that has gone into owning this toilet, except that it is twice what you might expect because I own TWO of the #@&% things! :mad:

If some law firm were ever willing to pursue a class action against AS for foisting this mis-engineered piece of junk onto the public, I'd be willing to put my name on the list. Who knows, I might actually get a replacement gasket out of the deal!

As for tossing them into the yard, I don't think that's necessary at this point... My little fixup is working better than OEM.

master plumber mark
12-05-2005, 04:56 PM
sounds like you are in it up to your eyebrows...
'
2 of those beauties in one house, oh what fun

I honestly dont think anyone could talk me into
doing the repairs that you have made to those pieces of junk...

they could not afford the money for the labor alone to have me
spend the best part of a day on one.....VS just throwing it away
and cutting their lossess...

At least you are handy and capable of doing it yourself...


you wonder what they are thinking at American Standard
these days to make such a piece of junk like this

Kristi
12-06-2005, 10:45 AM
a few PO'd champion owners? I'm not sure if i've heard anyone other than AS express how wonderful it is. I think the issue is not just the fact that the toilet is the least favourite for installers and ultimately users, it's the fact that AS is providing no support for these people when they need it. They should stand by their product, period. A company who ignores or challenges the installers/owners is not a company we (people) generally want to support. I for one have been a big AS supporter over the years, but all this Champion nonsense and their (non)handling of it has certainly crumbled my opinion of them... which is too bad as I do really like their faucets.
This site has shown me the way to the Toto light - they just aren't as "pretty" imo :)


http://www.totousa.com/images/products/CST794SF_zoom.jpg

Toto Nexus

Flushed in Bloomington
10-29-2006, 08:51 PM
I just can't believe that American Standard can't fix this Champion leak problem. They have sent me 2 red seals and it still leaks.

Paul G.
03-24-2007, 10:23 AM
My first time on this forum. Wish I had thought to type in magic words "American Standard Problems" BEFORE I ordered the Champian toilet in Sept. 04 for our bathroom renovation. :rolleyes: 1 year after installation (Sept. 2005) we found that toilet was running continually. Discovered that "no maintenance" means you can't buy parts from Home Depot etc. :p Called A.S. and ordered new tower replacement. Had to turn off water after each usage (repaired temp by re adjusting silicone seal) Called again after waiting 2 weeks..... Was finally told that my part was going to be shipped that day.:mad:
Replaced with new tower. No leaking but of course still that awfull clunking when flushed.:eek:
Now (March 2007) we have problem that pushing handle down will not flush toilet. I have removed the lid of tank and we have to raise the tower by hand. I am a Canadian, not American citizen, but if there was a company calling themselves "Canadian Standard" I would be after government to force them to change their name as I would not want others to think that Canadian standards were that low (if they existed at all.)
I will be calling A.S. on Monday and see what they will do. I am going to demand that they supply plumber to do repairs this time. May even go to local newspaper or TV station to see if they can help.

Paul

maddog
03-24-2007, 02:51 PM
I've had the no-flush problems a couple of times - the cup above the flush tower would disengage before lifting the flush tower. I called A.S. and they said that the end of the flush arm must be directly over the center of the flush tower. It should not pull side-ways at all when lifting. Mine was a bit off-center so I bent the flush arm a little so that it would be centered over the flush tower. This seemed to have fixed it - no more 'phantom' flushes. He also said that lengthening the chain to the flush tower by one bead may help also. It is a real mickey-mouse flush tower, but I haven't had any leaks or other problems yet after about 10 months. The thing can really flush though. I haven't tried golf balls yet but I have an old bowling ball in the closet ....