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View Full Version : How to fix a dripping Moen shower faucet?



walds11
11-28-2009, 01:16 PM
How do I go about fixing this? Very light dripping, but annoying. Attached is a pic of my shower set-up. Thanks in advance.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/drippingshowerfaucet.jpg

Terry
11-28-2009, 01:25 PM
I would guess Moen 1225B cartridge.

walds11
11-28-2009, 01:43 PM
Thanks Terry. Is this something I could pick up at my local Sears Hardware store? Can you provide me with instructions?


I would guess Moen 1225B cartridge.

jimbo
11-28-2009, 02:15 PM
The moen plastic pull out cartridge is widely available, certainly at Ace or blue or orange, and probably also at a sears outlet. There is a removal tool which is usually necessary, and you can buy that at any place that sells the cartridge.

walds11
11-28-2009, 04:17 PM
Plastic pull out cartridge? It looks metal to me. I was able to take the handle off. That is the easy part :) Do I need to turn the water off to get the cartridge out? I need more help. Thanks!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/drippingshowerfaucet1.jpg

hj
11-28-2009, 04:20 PM
If it is a metal stem, then you might need a plumber to extract it because you will not have the tool(s) needed to do it.

krow
11-28-2009, 04:35 PM
-Pull off the face plate
-pull off the sleeve
-Shut off your water and drain the system
-pull up the retainer clip and remove it (do not lose it or break it)
- Use your puller or the plastic cap that comes with the new 1225B catridge to move/dislodge the entire cartridge then pull entire catridge with a sturdy yank.
-Replace/reinstall new 1225B cartridge and retainer clip

The rest is easy.

hj
11-29-2009, 08:00 AM
quote; - Use your puller or the plastic cap that comes with the new 1225B catridge to move/dislodge the entire cartridge then pull entire catridge with a sturdy yank.

Spoken like someone who has NEVER had to remove a stuck brass stem from one. The "plastic removal cap" is a joke for anything other than a plastic stem which is loose enough that it does not need it.

walds11
11-29-2009, 08:05 AM
I am at Lowes right now. Lowes has replacement cartridge part 1225, not 1225B. The part is $19.97. Will this part work?They have the cartridge puller tool, $14.97. Wow, the job will cost me about $35, unless I can find the parts somewhere cheaper.

http://www.terrylove.com/images/moen1225.gif

jimbo
11-29-2009, 09:02 AM
Don't fret about the "B". There are ONLY TWO Moen cartridges, the brass one and the plastic one. We recommend the plastic.

If they are selling a cartridge for 12 bucks or so, it may be a generic. We recommend the genuine Moen piece, which is usually $15+. If you think that spending $35 to repair a faucet is anuything other than an incredible bargain, wait 'til you get the bill from the plumber you have to call because you tried to get it out without the $15 tool, and screwed up the body. Add a couple of zeros!!

walds11
11-29-2009, 09:12 AM
So, as long as I have the puller and the correct part, I good to go? I am fairly handy, but generally don't like to mess with plumbing and electricity.

krow
11-29-2009, 12:55 PM
Spoken like someone who has NEVER had to remove a stuck brass stem from one. The "plastic removal cap" is a joke for anything other than a plastic stem which is loose enough that it does not need it. Are you kidding me!?!?

You, my freind , haven't got the slightest clue of my abilities and what I am capable and licenced to do! You don't know me! So you can't sit there on your high chair judging me!!

I'm finding alot of the veterens of this site very insulting and making judgments about anybody else , especially the noobs that just want a quick answer to their problem.

Instead of critizing my credentials, why not actually try to help and give YOUR opinion on how to fix his dilema!

For your information, In 30 years that I have been plumbing , I only came across 1......... count them..........1 moen cartridge that I was not able to pull out........... and I ended up drilling that one out with no problems.

you really need to get more hands on experience in plumbing repairs

Terry
11-29-2009, 01:47 PM
hj plumbs in Arizona.

The water there must be very bad.
There are several plumbers that report that Moen gives them issues.

That is not the case with normal water, like the stuff we have in Seattle.
Moen is a breeze to repair here.
We pull the clip, pull the cartridge, and it's all downhill from there.

But then, we have good water here.

And get the genuine Moen, don't waste money on generic parts for these.
I have never needed a "removal tool" on Moen.

If you live in an area with hard water, you may need one.

krow
11-29-2009, 02:25 PM
That is not the case with normal water, like the stuff we have in Seattle.
Moen is a breeze to repair here.
We pull the clip, pull the cartridge, and it's all downhill from there.
.

Terry, you just proved my point. Conditions are not the same throughout North America. And for someone to sit there and judge other peoples experiences for their areas is not a way to conduct themselves with the "know it all " attitude

hj
11-30-2009, 04:25 AM
Since I have worked on Moen "Dialcet" faucets since they were created, (I installed the first one in the Chicago area in my own bathroom), and have had innumerable ones that resisted extraction, to the point where I have four different pullers in my truck, and some extractions require more than one, I guess my 60 years of experience, (in Chicago, Michigan, and Arizona), tops your 30. Your area may be such that EVERY brass Moen stem comes out with the plastic device, but in that case I think it may be the exception. As I have stated, that "last resort" puller, if it does not work, means you replace the valve. And if that puller does not work, the plastic DooDad would be completely worthless. But if you noticed I said your comment was from someone who "never had a stuck cartridge", which could be true in your case.

walds11
11-30-2009, 04:40 AM
Thanks for the advice everyone. I emailed my son's soccer coach who is actually master plumber. He claimed that 90% of the Meon catridges that he has worked with come out without the puller tool. We shall see.

I took the handle and the sleeve off to check things out. I can see the retainer clip. Now I have a good feel for what I need to do.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/drippingshowerfaucet2.jpg

Anyway, I plan on doing the job this weekend. I will buy the puller tool as well. If I don't need it, then I will return it. Stay tuned...

hj
11-30-2009, 05:09 AM
All of the discussion may be acedemic, because the picture seems to show a plastic stem which will usually extract somewhat easily.

krow
11-30-2009, 05:12 AM
I guess my 60 years of experience, (in Chicago, Michigan, and Arizona), tops your 30. Whats your point?? are you going on a pissing contest or what?

jimbo
11-30-2009, 05:36 AM
I'm with hj. Can't top the 60 years!! But in my much more modest experience, I never had a brass moen come out easily. Part of the problem is that it is such a good design! It works and is left alone far past the point where some "preventive maintenenance" would have helped, hence by the time you take it out, it is stuck in there good! The hard water in San Diego doesn't help.

walds11
12-05-2009, 11:39 AM
I picked up the parts today at Home Depot today. I bought the puller and some silicon grease as well which the guy at the store recommended. If I don't need the puller, then I will return it. Someone else said that Moen over-greases the cartridges and recommended that I take cartridge apart and wipe off grease. If I do not, the faucet will open by itself due to heavy grease and water pressure. Is this true? Stayed tuned for the results...

hj
12-05-2009, 02:18 PM
Yes, some of the plastic stems do turn on by themselves. I once was working at my sister-in-law's house and noticed that her shower valve was VERY hard to turn on, so I replaced the stem. That night she called and asked if I had repaired her shower valve, because when she grabbed the handle and gave it the tug she usually had to, it moved so easily she almost went through the opposite wall. YES, Moen valves, especially the brass stems do work LONG past the time when they should be serviced, but the user just gets used to them needing more and more effort to turn them on.

walds11
12-06-2009, 07:44 AM
The job was a peice of cake. I did not need the puller, so I will return it. The old cartridge came out very easily. Anyway, I am still getting a little drip after installing the new cartridge. I even noticed a slight drip after I turned the water off at the meter. Does the new cartridge need to break itself in? The drip with the water off at the meter tells me that the problem is not just the cartridge. Ugh!

Terry
12-06-2009, 11:47 AM
A tub faucet will continue to drain for 35 minutes after the valve is pushed off.

walds11
12-06-2009, 11:52 AM
Thanks Terry. I know there is always some drip right after you turn the faucet off, which may have been what I saw, but it appears fine now. Maybe it was some extra water that was left in the piping?*

Terry
12-06-2009, 12:11 PM
but it appears fine now. Maybe it was some extra water that was left in the piping?*


You can time yours.
Most take 35 minutes for all of the water to finish dripping out.

Most people don't notice, but for those that do, it can be an annoying plumbing call to babysit the tub faucet and explain that water sticks to the inside of a pipe, and takes that long to finally drip it's way dry.

Been there, done that.

walds11
12-07-2009, 04:37 PM
No dripping :D

My master bathroom shower has the same handle (no tub, just handle and shower head). Same Moen 1225 replacement cartridge?

krow
12-07-2009, 05:38 PM
No dripping :D

My master bathroom shower has the same handle (no tub, just handle and shower head). Same Moen 1225 replacement cartridge?

Yup, same rules apply

Doherty Plumbing
12-07-2009, 08:21 PM
I have never needed a puller to get a stuck cartridge out. I had to use WD-40 once to help break one free. But then again I'm 6'1 and 225 lbs.

walds11
12-12-2009, 11:14 AM
I need to replace the cartridge in the master bath shower as I stated a few posts above. I pulled the handle and collar off just to check things out. Yep, it's the same Meon 1225 cartridge. I put the collar and handle back on. The handle spins all the way around and does not stop in either direction. I never noticed this before. The shower is still fully functional with the hot-left and cold-right, butthe handle spins all the way around. Could I have put it back together wrong? May not matter because I am going to buy a replacement cartridge soon.

krow
12-12-2009, 03:43 PM
I need to replace the cartridge in the master bath shower as I stated a few posts above. I pulled the handle and collar off just to check things out. Yep, it's the same Meon 1225 cartridge. I put the collar and handle back on. The handle spins all the way around and does not stop in either direction. I never noticed this before. The shower is still fully functional with the hot-left and cold-right, butthe handle spins all the way around. Could I have put it back together wrong? May not matter because I am going to buy a replacement cartridge soon.

It could be that the tabs in the handle have broken off or the handle is the wrong one for that particular faucet.
ie: a lav faucet handle will fit the shower, but it will not sit at the right depth for the tabs to engage the stops

walds11
12-12-2009, 04:18 PM
I pulled the handle off again. It does not look like the tabs in the handle have broken off. I pulled the handle off the other shower that I replaced the cartidge and compared the tabs. The tabs are definitely different (different shape and positioned differently). I don't even remember if the handle stopped or not before :confused: I use the darn shower every day. Anyway, is there any risk as long as I don't go spinning the handle around and around?


It could be that the tabs in the handle have broken off or the handle is the wrong one for that particular faucet.
ie: a lav faucet handle will fit the shower, but it will not sit at the right depth for the tabs to engage the stops

krow
12-12-2009, 05:06 PM
Absolutley no risk of anything bad happening, whether it spins or not, just an annoyance.

Botoo
12-13-2009, 07:14 AM
If your Moen still drips, you would have to take it apart again and clean the barrel of the valve and make sure there is no foreign matter anywhere in the new cartridge or barrel. I had to do this twice.

Also mine, which looks just like yours, has two plastic pieces that fit into the stainless sleeve, which limit the turn of the handle. Are you sure these are in right? or not forgotten?

Hope I could help. I am very familiar with these.

walds11
12-13-2009, 07:35 AM
It does not drip anymore.

I am working on the shower faucet in my master bathroom now. Attached are two pics. I still can't remember if the handle stopped in either direction before I took it apart yesterday. Maybe I put it back together incorrectly?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/mastershower2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/mastershower1.jpg

walds11
12-13-2009, 08:01 AM
And attached is a pic of the handle from my other bathroom shower (the one I replacement the cartridge eariler in the post). This handle works perfectly in my master bathroom shower. You can tell the differences between the handles. The first one has a larger diameter opening, a plastic ring inside and the tabs are in a different position.

part number for first one is 96997 and second one is 14114.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v25/walds11/hallbath.jpg

So now what? Buy a new handle?

Botoo
12-13-2009, 09:53 AM
The 2 plastic pieces that I am referring to are shown in the enclosed picture as "C" and the other is shown installed into the stainless sleeve already.
These limit the travel of the handle and you can set them to limit the water temperature.

Yours may be different, but there must have been something like this. Maybe the shaft of the replacement cartridge you purchased is a little longer. That could be the problem.

walds11
12-13-2009, 10:16 AM
I have a different set-up. The plastic handle just slides onto the metal collar. There are no other parts involved that I am aware of.

krow
12-13-2009, 11:20 AM
The 2nd handle that you posted looks like a posi-temp handle. It works entirely different than the first handle. The positemp faucet rotates to turn it on.

I suspect that the 2nd handle was replaced at one point with a positemp handle. It may have been replaced by a previous owner who may not have known the difference between the 2 handles. Botoo is showing the basic positemp faucet in his pic

walds11
12-13-2009, 11:31 AM
That makes sense. I was at Lowes today and they had the same handle that I posted in post #34. It was labeled posi-temp handle on the box. I have to pull the handle to turn the water on, not rotate it. It's the wrong handle as you suspected. No big deal, just a minor annoyance.

jrob455
12-14-2009, 03:20 PM
Hi, I'm new here, and am just a do-it-yourselfer, not a plumber.

Yesterday I replaced a Moen positemp shower catridge that had been dripping for a month or so, then suddenly started leaking in more of a light stream. The old cartridge, by the way, was VERY hard to remove--I had to use a small pry bar and wooden blocks to gradually leverage it out.

I put in the replacement cartridge and the dripping stopped, everything seemed to be working fine. But now today, less than 24 hours later, a slow but steady drip has started again. Any ideas on what the problem could be and how to fix it?

Thanks.

krow
12-14-2009, 04:04 PM
Hi, I'm new here, and am just a do-it-yourselfer, not a plumber.

Yesterday I replaced a Moen positemp shower catridge that had been dripping for a month or so, then suddenly started leaking in more of a light stream. The old cartridge, by the way, was VERY hard to remove--I had to use a small pry bar and wooden blocks to gradually leverage it out.

I put in the replacement cartridge and the dripping stopped, everything seemed to be working fine. But now today, less than 24 hours later, a slow but steady drip has started again. Any ideas on what the problem could be and how to fix it?

Thanks.

In the process of removing the old cartridge, a peice of rubber may have broken off inside the brass body or some sediment may have loosened up in the chambers.

You can try pulling the cartridge out and flushing th lines, cleaning the cartridge. These moen cartridges are very sensitive to foreign debris, so its very likely that the new cartridge may have been damaged in the install process. It may warrent a new cartridge again.

Usually you can contact moen on their 1 800 number and they will send you a new cartridge with-in 3 working days free of charge

walds11
12-14-2009, 05:33 PM
I bought my first catridge at Home Depot last week. Cost me about $19. I totally forgot that Moen offers a limited lifetime warranty on parts. I just called Moen tonight for a replacement cartridge for my other shower. They asked if I was the original owner and if I had proof of purchase. I do not have the proof of purchase, but they still sent me a replacement cartridge 1225 for free. Yes!!!

jrob455
12-15-2009, 01:24 PM
Thanks, Krow. I wasn't previously aware of the warranty by Moen. This morning I called them, and they said they'd send me a new cartridge for free (although they tried to talk me into paying to receive expedited shipping).

I also hadn't previously been aware of the importance of making sure to use a genuine Moen replacement part. The replacement cartridge I installed turns out to be some generic brand--Danco--that's made in China (could be part of the problem with why it still leaks!), and that my local hardware store sold me as a replacement for my Moen cartridge for the "bargain" price of $44. I think I'll pull it out, stick the old Moen cartridge back in--the amount of leaking between it and the new one isn't that great--and see if I can get a refund.

I noticed when I removed the old cartridge that the interior of the bronze fixture has some greenish mineral deposits or corrosion (I guess we have bad water here in Houston), which I wonder, after reading this column, might be causing the drip. I tried to remove them with a small wire brush before putting the replacement cartridge in, but wasn't able to get all traces out. When I open up the valve again, do you suggest that I try polishing the interior of the fixture with fine emery cloth to get it completely smooth?

Thanks again for the advice.

krow
12-15-2009, 04:49 PM
NO EMERY CLOTH.

Just a little bit of white vinegar (red vinegar is for salads) Get as much cleaned as possible, but don't go crazy. It should be fine.

The chinese stuff doesn't handle very good, does it.

walds11
12-21-2009, 05:07 PM
You are correct. The incorrect handle was on there. It is for a posi-temp faucet. I called Moen and they sent me the correct handle for free :) It's amazing what a new cartridge and handle will do. Like good as new.



The 2nd handle that you posted looks like a posi-temp handle. It works entirely different than the first handle. The positemp faucet rotates to turn it on.

I suspect that the 2nd handle was replaced at one point with a positemp handle. It may have been replaced by a previous owner who may not have known the difference between the 2 handles. Botoo is showing the basic positemp faucet in his pic

jrob455
12-24-2009, 10:14 AM
I finally received the replacement cartridge from Moen--they sent it for free, but tried to talk me into paying to get it rushed--and once I put it in, the dripping stopped completely. I did gently polish the inside of the fixture with some rouge cloth--vinegar alone wasn't getting rid of a couple of deposits that had built up over time, and I was concerned that they might have been breaking the seal and causing the dripping.

So here's another example of the factory part fixing a problem that a generic replacement didn't--I'm a believer! At least the local hardware store refunded my money for the generic cartridge.

Thanks again for the help, and Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all.

http://www.terrylove.com/images/moen1225.gif

woody p
12-26-2009, 10:44 PM
Don't fret about the "B". There are ONLY TWO Moen cartridges, the brass one and the plastic one. We recommend the plastic.

If they are selling a cartridge for 12 bucks or so, it may be a generic. We recommend the genuine Moen piece, which is usually $15+. If you think that spending $35 to repair a faucet is anuything other than an incredible bargain, wait 'til you get the bill from the plumber you have to call because you tried to get it out without the $15 tool, and screwed up the body. Add a couple of zeros!!


I used the tool to remove the stem but apparently I didn't remove the entire stem. The part I did extract is brass but it does not look like the replacement. Do I really have to call a plumber to get the rest of it out... or is there another tool?

ClayTwo
01-17-2010, 02:47 PM
I have almost the same equipment as was first reported in this thread. Only the outside handle is different. My original problem was that sometimes the water changed temperature from hot to cold unexpectedly occasionally. My shower is only 5 years old.

Called Moen and got two replacement parts, a 1423 spool and a 1225 cartridge. The result after installation of both is a shower that continually runs at a low pressure. Can't change the pressure or temperature.

I did lose the retainer pin in the wall somewhere. Made a temporary one out of a plastic coated paper clip.

Snowbirdad
02-12-2010, 02:36 PM
I have replace the cartridge on my moen single handle shower faucet with a danco MO-1 and I didn't have any tempter control,so I took it out and saw that some of the O rings where torn , I replace them and reinstall it but had the same problem ,then I decided to replace the O rings on the original and put it back in but I still have no tempter control what am I doing wrong?

krow
02-12-2010, 03:04 PM
I still have no tempter control What do you mean by tempter control? Are you talking about pressure balancing?
If so, your balancing spool needs attention/replacement

Snowbirdad
02-12-2010, 04:31 PM
The faucet was leaking so I replaced with the danco cartridge and after I replaced it no matter which way I turn the faucet it made no difference in the tempter it stayed warm as if both the hot and cold were on. I don't know what a balancing spool, is something in the body of the faucet?

krow
02-12-2010, 04:39 PM
I have to say that the danco spindle is your problem. If I understood you correctly, It seems that the hot and cold are mixing in any position that the handle is in . Where I am , the danco is almost obsolete. We now use the plastic spindles with lifetime warranty.

Snowbirdad
02-12-2010, 05:50 PM
What bothers me is the original cartriage never had that problem until I put it back in ,but I guess I'll try the plastic one and see what happens. Thanks
Is the plastic cartridge made by moen ?

krow
02-12-2010, 06:19 PM
Made by moen #1225B

korkiley
02-14-2010, 07:08 AM
My Moen shower faucet was leaking and I followed the instructions here and easily repaired it. At first, I was confused by the black plastic removal tool that came with my genuine replacement cylinder. Since the instructions didn't describe the part, I thought it was part of the cylinder and, until I realized it's purpose and used it to turn the old cylinder a bit (I guess it just loosens things up a bit because there are no threaded parts.) I was unable to remove the old cylinder. But once I turned the cylinder a bit, I screwed the faucet handle back on and easily pulled the cylinder out.

OK. That is all common, but here comes the interesting part. I live in a condo and have been plagued by a vibration in the cold water supply line (I feel/hear the vibration in the pipe that supplies the water heater) for two or three years. It can happen when you turn on a faucet (about any faucet in the place) or it can happen in the middle of the night when we aren't using the water at all. I have been very suspicious of a relationship with the use of water in the neighboring condo.

My Moen faucet began leaking two days ago when I was replacing a washer in the outside sill cock. I had opened all of the faucets to drain the pipes. When I had finished my washer replacement I first turned the main shutoff back on and then proceeded to turn off all the faucets beginning in the upstairs bathroom. But when I tried to turn off the Moen shower faucet in the upstairs bathroom, the faucet would not shut off. I kept turning it back and forth and pushing in and out and eventually I was able to push it in again. This was interesting because I suddenly remembered that the same thing had happened a few years ago and I now wondered if this could be related to the vibrating pipe, and maybe it had all started a few years ago after this incident.

But back to the present--I have no idea what happened this time, but for a peaceful day after this, the vibration seemed to be gone. However, yesterday morning I discovered that the Moen faucet that had stuck was leaking, and that is what brought me to find this excellent thread and easily repair the problem. The sad news is that the pipe vibration is back--but there is more!

I was showing my wife the old cylinder and how it worked. While doing so, I noticed some white material in the water inlet area and after prying and tugging a bit, I extracted a piece of plastic. I knew immediately what it was!

About two years ago and after the vibration had plagued us for about a year, we replaced our water heater. When the plumber disassembled the hot water outlet pipe, he discovered several pieces of white plastic jambed in the copper pipe. He determined that the white plastic cold water inlet tube (or hot water outlet tube--I forget which) had disintegrated and gotten forced out into the hot water line. I can now see that pieces of this tube must been forced much further from the source and perhaps that was causing the vibration somehow.

Perhaps I shouldn't have gone into all this detail with this problem in this thread but I couldn't resist because of the chain of events and the possible cause and effect. Hopefully there might be an enthusiastic plumbing sleuth that will read this and shed some light on what is threatening to become a cold case!

Kor Kiley

krow
02-14-2010, 10:54 AM
Well, You may not be out of hot water yet (no punns intended). I suspect that there may be more plastic pieces in the water pipe. Its only a question of "where they will end up". Usually they will stay lodged . but if anybody shuts off the water or disrupts the water flow, its a good possibility that they will move. I am suspecting one of 2 things.
1) plastic peices may have become lodged in a hot water shut off valve serving one of your fixtures

2) the vibrating could be unrelated and you should be looking at a dripping flapper and bad ballcock in your toilet. Your comment here points in that direction.
It can happen when you turn on a faucet (about any faucet in the place) or it can happen in the middle of the night when we aren't using the water at all.

korkiley
02-19-2010, 08:22 AM
Yes, I would be very surprised if there were no more pieces in my lines. I recently managed to cough up a piece by removing the aerators from the faucets and running the water on full for a while. Is there some method I could use to try to flush out the rest?

As to the toilets, I recently replaced the flapper and ballcock on my upstairs bathroom. I've also replaced the ballcock downstairs and I've experimented by closing the shutoffs to both of these toilets. Shouldn't the problem disappear while the shutoffs were closed? Unfortunately, it did not.

Thanks for your help!

Kor

jadnashua
02-19-2010, 09:38 AM
1/4-turn ball valve shutoffs are better at passing crud in the lines than the multi-turn valves.

krow
02-19-2010, 11:08 AM
Yes, I would be very surprised if there were no more pieces in my lines. I recently managed to cough up a piece by removing the aerators from the faucets and running the water on full for a while. Is there some method I could use to try to flush out the rest?Not unless you are replacing any valves or do a re-pipe at portions of your system. Problem is there is no way to determine which parts of your system have peices.. Be patient, they will eventually move to the aeraters, as you found out.


As to the toilets, I recently replaced the flapper and ballcock on my upstairs bathroom. I've also replaced the ballcock downstairs and I've experimented by closing the shutoffs to both of these toilets. Shouldn't the problem disappear while the shutoffs were closed? Unfortunately, it did not.

Thanks for your help!

Kor

further investigation is defenitely required.If nobody is using the water in your unit, then the problem may be coming from another unit , above, below or next to you

korkiley
02-19-2010, 03:06 PM
further investigation is defenitely required.If nobody is using the water in your unit, then the problem may be coming from another unit , above, below or next to you

Interesting that you should say that. I had almost forgotten--when the problem first appeared, there seemed to be no relationship to what we were doing and when we were hearing the sound. Not only that, but I was fairly certain that I had only heard the sound when the neighbor was home. I finally asked her if she had been hearing the vibrating noise that we were. Much to my surprise, she said that she had heard nothing. She agreed to run water and flush toilets and all kinds of things at her place so I could see if a cause and effect was at work. After about 15 minutes she returned to our place and said that she had tried all the activities. Again, I was surprised to find that nothing had happened in our unit.

Finally, after about ten or fifteen minutes, there came a long vibration! So, at least my neighbor knew that I wasn't making it up because I was standing talking to her when it happened.

Gradually, over a year's time, the nature of this even changed. Now there is a direct cause and effect in our own unit. Usually we hear the vibration just as we are turning on the water, especially if the faucet is just cracked. Once turned on full, the noise disappears. Sometimes we hear the sound out of the blue. In this case, turning a faucet on stops the vibrating.

By the way, we have an end unit, so we only have the one neighbor.

jadnashua
02-19-2010, 03:26 PM
Some styles of toilet filler valves can cause chattering. This is often a random thing accompanied by a slow leak with the flapper valve so the tank refills at odd times. Try turning the supply off to the toilets, verify that the tanks remain full, and see if that correlates to anything. You might want to check the water pressure as well. If you have high pressure, again, some toilet filer valves can't handle it and will make some noise. Fixing a leaking valve may mean that there's now no outlet for that pressure (spike?), and you now have more static pressure than you had before.

krow
02-19-2010, 03:41 PM
Just to add to jadnashua's reply, another thing to look at is a 2 handle faucet. What you described in your last post may also happen with a bad spindle (most cases the hot side, but it can happen to the cold side too). It could be coming from any number of places, ...........

But I'm leaning towards a bad ballcock somewhere if its only your unit.

northeast_chileman
10-09-2011, 03:43 PM
The MOEN I have was exactly like some of the pictures (The one with the two brass blades visibile-retaing clip.), Home Depot had OEM, the included tool easily moved the original valve, the original valve came out easily, replacement slid in easily and the drip is gone. The one thing I would add is there was (2) two brass and (1) plastic MOEN valves in stock.
Thanks again, Krow!

Lgbpop
01-09-2012, 07:52 PM
Every forum has a thread that won't die, I guess this one is it and am I ever happy I found it! As several others have had, I've got a shower fixture that went from tight, to a drip, to a trickle. I cleaned off the mineral deposit beneath the collar sticking out of the wall plate and it's a Moen. Looks to be an easy fix, thanks to you all. I'll be sure to let you know how I make out.

For what it's worth, I've spent some time in property maintenance in commercial and medical buildings and a couple of plumbers I've helped while replacing hot-water heaters insist on soldering in a vertical length of pipe on the heater intake line, just before the line is attached to the heater. They claim air in the water pipes will cause that pipe chatter, and that the vertical pipe allows the air to be trapped before it gets into the wall plumbing and out to the faucets. I'm skeptical about it still, but I never heard pipe vibration in a system when that piece was added. Anyone care to confirm (or laugh at) this?

jimbo
01-10-2012, 07:21 AM
Well, since the thread has come back from the dead...why not! I am sure folks in places that have smooooooth soft water naturally find moens easy to fix. Down here in the southwest, that is FAR from the case. Any moen stem which has been in place several years of more ( which is usually the case, since they are reliable from the get-go) will NOT give up without a fight. hj has mentioned about 7 or 8 different methods and special tools. I have used some of them. The white plastic tool is a joke. The Moen brand puller works on maybe an under-f year valve, but if not on ones that are in there for 10+. The generic tool with the skinny rod is useful, but also a "last ditch tool" since if it fails, it fails stuck in the wall! Hence the other variations that hj and others have engineered.

YUP...we like Moen, but it is NOT an easy repair in this neck of the woods.

jadnashua
01-10-2012, 01:09 PM
A simple air column as a hammer arrester is a waste of time and materials. If you need or want one, it needs to be as close to the offending valve as possible, and at the water source is not the place for even a true, engineered hammer arrester. A hammer arrester is needed at quick closing valves - some toilet valves, a few shower valves, and solonoid controlled valves like washing machines, ice makers, etc. The typical valve does not need one. What can cause water hammer on a 'normal' valve is a loose washer - it can chatter on its seat which creates the start/stop required to initiate water hammer. The fix there is fix the valve, not mask it with a hammer arrester. The air in a length of piping used as a hammer arrester gets absorbed fairly quickly, and the thing quickly loses its effectivness. Plus, it's a trap for stagnet water and rarely drains well to 'recharge' it like a soda straw with your finger over the end...once it's full of water, it tends to stay that way.

Lgbpop
01-11-2012, 08:32 AM
I always wondered how/why that would work in the first place. Simple physics and common sense tell me air is compressible only as much as the amount of pressure put upon it, and once that limit is reached things go back to the way they were. I just never waited long enough for that to happen. Thanks for confirming I'm not as stupid as those experts made me out to feel.

Lgbpop
02-08-2012, 05:19 PM
I can't believe it's been a month already, just wanted to say thanks to all for the tips that have been posted here. I did get that cartridge out, in two pieces. The 1/2" tap and bolt solution worked a treat. Even after spraying vinegar into the cartridge shell after the core pulled out, years of deposits still took a while to break loose but slow-and-easy did it. Just used the hex-head end of the Moen removal tool instead of a deep-well socket. I wound up repeating the experience in the other bathroom shower, so the money I spent on the tools definitely paid for itself. Cheers -

jhansman
08-18-2012, 12:16 PM
Hello all-Found this site when I went searching for an answer on how to replace the cartridge in my Moen Dialcet that's been in the house since before I bought it (35 yrs. ago). The info here really helped me understand what to do and how to do it. Bought both the new, plastic cart and the removal tool from Moen. Unlike some you, I did not get the cart free from Moen, because I was not the original owner (could have said I was, but...). No biggie ($15), but the removal tool, which I needed to extract the cart (that plastic thing they enclose with it is a joke) was twice as much, and I'll likely never use it again. The job went fairly easy; the toughest part was getting the retaining clip out, as my hard water had built up a lot of calcification around it (Lime Away to the rescue). If anyone is interested in buying my barely used extraction tool, please email or PM me and we'll work something out. Anyway, just a thanks to all for the good info.