PDA

View Full Version : washer vent, is this ok?



Pabs
10-10-2009, 06:56 PM
hi all

new to this forum... been looking arounf and it seems lkke there's lots of good advice here

here's my situation. I'm in the middle of a bahroom reno
I'm doing the reno in order to put my washer and dryer on the main floor bathroom.

This was the existing plumbing .

http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/before.jpg

I would like to tie in the washer to this system. is branching into like the pic below ok? can they both share the same vent in this manner?

http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/vent.jpg

if so, are there distance minimums/maximums? can I put the inlet for the washer directly below the inlet for the sink? does the height of the washer inlet need to be at a certain height relative to the sink? etc

thanks for taking the time

Pabs

jadnashua
10-10-2009, 07:35 PM
Note I'm not a pro...technically, since the WM T's into the pipe below the sink, it isn't a vent. You should be able to move it up and use the proper x fitting. Note, the WM drain line needs to be 2", and the sink's line may not be. There's probably some other things involved...wait for the pros. For power, code normally requires a dedicated circuit for the WM, but since it is in a bathroom, that might have to be a GFI. Not sure about that, either, but something to look into.

Pabs
10-10-2009, 09:07 PM
makes sense,

this would be a better design I think.
http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/ventMod.jpg
the washer drain has to be 2 ...but the sink is only 1 1/2" correct?

if hte WM drain has to be 2" then I won't have a choice but to make the whole thing out of 2" pipe I guess....right?


Pabs

Winslow
10-10-2009, 09:38 PM
hi all

new to this forum... been looking arounf and it seems lkke there's lots of good advice here

here's my situation. I'm in the middle of a bahroom reno
I'm doing the reno in order to put my washer and dryer on the main floor bathroom.

This was the existing plumbing .

http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/before.jpg

I would like to tie in the washer to this system. is branching into like the pic below ok? can they both share the same vent in this manner?

http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/vent.jpg

if so, are there distance minimums/maximums? can I put the inlet for the washer directly below the inlet for the sink? does the height of the washer inlet need to be at a certain height relative to the sink? etc

thanks for taking the time

Pabs

This configuration is fine as long as the drain is 2 inch up to the lav drain. The vent above the top tee needs to be 1 1/2 inch. It is a simple wet vent configuration (the section between the W/M drain and the lav drain serves as both the drain for the lav and a (wet) vent for the W/M.

Terry
10-10-2009, 11:40 PM
http://terrylove.com/images/washer_rough_b.jpg

It depends on the inspector and the local code.
The picture above will pass anywhere.

Or you could wet vent a lav, above the washer in some areas if you leave the pipe 2" until the 2 x 1.5 x 1.5 santee.
The 2" pipe allows wet venting in that case.

Peter Griffin
10-11-2009, 05:03 AM
It does depend on the inspector and your adopted code. IPC now wants washers dumped into a 3" stack or main.

jimbo
10-11-2009, 07:55 AM
The UPC does allow connection as shown in your second diagram ( washing machine vented). The trap must be located between 6 and 18 inches above the floor. Length of standpipe must be between 18 and 30 inches.

In your first diagram, the WM is wet vented which is not allowed. Wet venting is limited to 1DFU and 2DFU fixtures. WM is 3DFU. Only exception is that a single bathroom group may be wet vented.

Pabs
10-11-2009, 04:09 PM
The trap must be located between 6 and 18 inches above the floor.

6 inches, is that done so that you can get at them and clean them out if needed. I assume that's what's it's for.. .can't really figure out why the 18 inch limit though??


Length of standpipe must be between 18 and 30 inches.


when you say length of standpipe between 18 and 30 do you mean the lenght before it reaches the p trap? you are not talking about the overall height of the floor correct? and, just tobe sure, when you speak of the standpipe you refer to the pipe the drain hose goes into correct?


are there any restrictions as to where I can put the connections in reference to one another? in the image below, do the distances C,D and E have an restrictions?
i'm working with limited space, so if I'm able to put them close together that would be great..

http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/vent2.jpg

Pabs

jadnashua
10-11-2009, 04:23 PM
I think that distance C should be enough to go 6" above the flood plane of the sink, or 42", whichever is higher to make the connection.

Pabs
10-11-2009, 08:14 PM
6" above the sink line or 42"...
what's with the 42? that would be 42 from the T? why o high?
I can swing 6 above... 42 woul be pushing it given the space I'm working in
Pabs

Runs with bison
10-11-2009, 09:47 PM
It does depend on the inspector and your adopted code. IPC now wants washers dumped into a 3" stack or main.

Seems like overkill with the new lower volume clothes washers becoming common. My front loader uses 12 gallons/load vs. 44 gallons/load in my old top loader. Are they going after a foaming issue? In engineering design 2" is good for about 8 gpm for self venting flow.

hj
10-12-2009, 05:37 AM
Your original second drawing is one way I have been installing washing machine drains for decades. The third drawing is overkill, and does NOTHING to improve the drainage.

jimbo
10-12-2009, 06:25 AM
The tie in for the vent must be 6" above the flood rim of the any fixture on the line. That is usually just taken as 42" above the floor. The sink might only be 32" high, but you would have to be 6" above top of the washing machine drum also.
The length of standpipe is the pipe up from the trap.

Pabs
10-12-2009, 06:26 AM
Your original second drawing is one way I have been installing washing machine drains for decades. The third drawing is overkill, and does NOTHING to improve the drainage.

you mean this one?
http://www.pevweb.com/plumbing/ventMod.jpg

jeffeverde
10-12-2009, 08:57 AM
I assume that last stretch of supply line is PEX? Why the foam wrap on the PEX but not the copper?


http://terrylove.com/images/washer_rough_b.jpg

It depends on the inspector and the local code.
The picture above will pass anywhere.

Or you could wet vent a lav, above the washer in some areas if you leave the pipe 2" until the 2 x 1.5 x 1.5 santee.
The 2" pipe allows wet venting in that case.

yesterdayze
10-12-2009, 09:25 AM
Normally I would think you would need that air vent connection to avoid that being a wet vent since you typically only want to do that with say a sink, shower toilet setup, and even then....

Even if it isn't needed by code where you are, it will still often make a difference in how much fun gurgling noises and exciting smells you get coming up out of the washer pipe after someone fills the sink to the top then pulls the plug and the water passing by pulls all the water out of the washer drain line trap. So the 10 minutes and 7 dollars worth of material may be worth just doing it.

My house was setup just like your original second picture and every once in a while we would get some real charming smells after the sink had been filled up then drained. I added an air vent like you have in the third picture (though it connected higher up) and no more issue.

*JUST OPINION, I am not a plumber, just diy'er - I differ to the experts ;)*

Peter Griffin
10-12-2009, 10:39 AM
Terry's photo would be the correct way to go about it and will indeed pass just about anywhere with the exception that the IPC would now make you run 3" up to where the washer dumps in. Personally I think it's overkill and I would like to see the documentation of problems that have caused them to make that amendment. Then again it could be because the plastic companies are not selling enough 3 x 2 san tees :rolleyes:

jadnashua
10-12-2009, 11:38 AM
While the newest WM front loaders use less water by far than the older top loading ones, they tend to dump that water out faster so there's a chance of a backup if you don't go bigger. Depends on how many bends, and what else may drop into that waste line if you'd have a problem; but, if it is big enough, it shouldn't matter. Yes, the hose isn't all that big in diameter, but the dynamics of a pumped verses gravity flow can make a big difference.

hj
10-12-2009, 12:19 PM
NO. The lower one in the original posting with the washer into a sanitary tee in the riser.

Pabs
10-13-2009, 05:49 AM
NO. The lower one in the original posting with the washer into a sanitary tee in the riser.

but doesn't that create a wet vent? I thought wet vents were not allowed in most cases...

Pabs

Runs with bison
10-13-2009, 06:30 AM
but doesn't that create a wet vent? I thought wet vents were not allowed in most cases...

Pabs

FWIW I agree with you. What you drew is the same configuration as what Terry's picture shows (with the vent tee angle reversed, might want to check that.) It looks like #2 is allowed by code in many places though. Practically, HJ is probably correct that it is overkill to do the separation of the vents on the same floor level, but the venting capacity of the 3rd picture is greater than that of the 2nd anytime that the sink above is flowing.

jimbo
10-13-2009, 06:35 AM
but doesn't that create a wet vent? I thought wet vents were not allowed in most cases...

Pabs

Some would argue that a wet vent IS the PREFERRED method....where it's use is appropriate. A bathroom group on one floor is appropriate. A washing machine does not qualify as part of the bathroom group, AND a washing machine + sink exceeds the DFU allowed on a wet vent (UPC). Note that wet venting a toilet is an allowed exception to the aformentioned DFU limit.

And, among his other admirable qualities, hj is also very practical. The truth is that the first design shown at the top of this long thread would probably work OK, with little or no problems over the long run. It has code issues, hence the thread that goes on like the energizer bunny!!

Terry Love
10-13-2009, 10:36 AM
For twenty years, I wet vented the laundry tray "over" the washer.
Yes, it does work.
But it no longer passes and inspection in many places.

So spend $6.00 more and pass your inspection the first time.
Now that's a no-brainer.

Dunbar Plumbing
10-13-2009, 10:53 AM
Over the years in these plumbing forums I've watched the software programs for plumbing illustrations get better and better over time.

Most of the time however the ones creating those images of plumbing are not licensed plumbers, or unlicensed!


I need to build a plumbing software to design plumbing systems for plumbers that is as simple as swinging a hammer, because I've seen some of the programs and they are just too involved if you're not computer inclined.

And most that say "Oh that's easy to use" is someone who has mastered the talent and has been using it for a long time.

Somehow, somewhere I'm going to get my crayons out and make this happen. I know I can.

Pabs
10-13-2009, 05:37 PM
hey all.
thanks for the many tips! In the end I will go the overkill road.. that way I won't worry about it, plus I have the spare pipe (left overs from my Buddie's last reno)

one quick last question regading this set up... I bought a washer outlet box (2 valves and and an intake for the drain).
I've been reading online that it must/should be installed at 42". but my manual for the washer says the drain can be installed anywhere from 24" to 96". Since I'm stacking the machines if I put the box at 42 it will interfere with the dryer hose,, I have it set up right now at 32 inches (bottom of box).
anything wrong in doing it like that?

thanks again for all the help... I'll post some pics of the finish plumbing this week once I'm done!

Pabs