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jaxbldginspector
01-19-2009, 06:28 PM
What are the requirements for a main disconnect on 200 amp service?
Is a disconnect required at the meter or will a 200 amp panel with a disconnect be correct? The panel box is not located on an interior wall right behind the meter, it is at least 20 ft away from the meter. The main wire going to the panel would always be hot with no way to turn if off without calling the power company or pulling the meter.

Thanks for any input.

Speedy Petey
01-19-2009, 07:58 PM
I hate to seem like a jerk, but you are the building inspector. What do your local codes say?

According to the NEC you would need a disconnect "installed at a readily accessible location either outside of a building or structure or inside nearest the point of entrance of the service conductors."

jwelectric
01-20-2009, 10:24 AM
I hate to seem like a jerk, but you are the building inspector. What do your local codes say?


Petey
Ever seen a "building inspector" that had enough sense to get in out of the rain?

codeone
01-20-2009, 10:39 AM
Petey
Ever seen a "building inspector" that had enough sense to get in out of the rain?

Mike , you know we will turn you down anytime! Rain or Shine. And enjoy it! Mel

jwelectric
01-20-2009, 10:43 AM
Mike , you know we will turn you down anytime! Rain or Shine. And enjoy it! Mel


See here is one that admitts he will stay out in the rain even if it is just to turn someone down.

Mel We all know that the inspectors are like the mail carriers. Neither rain or snow will keep an inspector from doing his job.

jaxbldginspector
02-03-2009, 04:33 PM
If my name was Obama I guess you would think I was the President of the United States?

Scuba_Dave
02-03-2009, 05:00 PM
In MA the main wires going to the panel are always hot unless the meter is pulled

Are you the President?

Speedy Petey
02-03-2009, 06:07 PM
If my name was Obama I guess you would think I was the President of the United States?I have absolutely NO idea what this means. :confused::rolleyes:

codeone
02-03-2009, 07:32 PM
I have absolutely NO idea what this means. :confused::rolleyes:


Maybe Imposter? Fraud? ETC?

Speedy Petey
02-04-2009, 03:36 AM
Oh. DUH!!!!!!!!! :o :o

No jax, but if you come on a home improvement message board with a name like yours why would we have reason to think anything else???

hj
02-04-2009, 06:46 AM
Here, there MUST be a main disconnect at the meter so the power company can disconnect the house if they wish to avoid power surges into the building. IT can be a simple disconnect, or the house panel with a main disconnect, but must be able to disable the entire building.

220/221
02-04-2009, 11:12 AM
The main wire going to the panel would always be hot with no way to turn if off without calling the power company or pulling the meter.

It's stupid and IMO dangerous but NEC allows it.

Like HJ says, you can't do it in AZ. In some places you can just run exposed cable tacked to the side of the building. :eek:

Scuba_Dave
02-04-2009, 11:48 AM
Here, there MUST be a main disconnect at the meter so the power company can disconnect the house if they wish to avoid power surges into the building. IT can be a simple disconnect, or the house panel with a main disconnect, but must be able to disable the entire building.

Would that disconnect be the meter itself?
Or inside the meter base?
Our Main panel is in the basement
The meter is directly outside - up about 16" on the outside wall

Speedy Petey
02-04-2009, 11:58 AM
It's stupid and IMO dangerous but NEC allows it.Why would you say this?

Very few areas require an outside shutoff. Because you are one of them you think it is stupid not to have it.

That is like saying Chicago is right for requiring all conduit in a residence and the rest of the country is stupid. :rolleyes:

220/221
02-04-2009, 02:36 PM
Why would you say this?


IMO means "In my opinion"......right?

I can offer an explanation but it's not really up for debate because it is simply my opinion.

I have seen numerous fires on cable WITH protection, especially higher amperage protection like water heater/range and AC cable. A fault on an unfused/protected cable would certainly be likely to cause a fire.

Things are always happening to cables in peoples houses. How many sawsalled cables have you repaired/replaced? Houses are constantly being renovated and often by the homeowners themselves. I think it is only prudent to provide overcurrent protection on any cable run inside a house or within reach of people in normal circunstances.




Very few areas require an outside shutoff. Because you are one of them you think it is stupid not to have it.

A lot of places in the world have seriously substandard electrical systems, You look at the pics from India and think "That is stupid" not because you live in a place with a reasonably safe system but because you know and have seen the dangers involved.

Chicago?

It is my opinion that conduit and wire systems are more safe than NM systems but I do think NM systems are safe enough.

Speedy Petey
02-04-2009, 02:47 PM
IMO means "In my opinion"......right?

I can offer an explanation but it's not really up for debate because it is simply my opinion.
I know it is your opinion. I was just wondering what you were basing this on. That's all.




A lot of places in the world have seriously substandard electrical systems,
I'm not talking about the rest of the world. I am talking about the MAJORITY of OUR country.

220/221
02-04-2009, 03:21 PM
I am talking about the MAJORITY of OUR country.


Bah!

Don't make me look up statistics but I will wager that a majority of current installations are not done hillbilly style :D

Speedy Petey
02-04-2009, 03:30 PM
Well, I'd be curious to know just how many areas REQUIRE an outside disconnect. I don't think it's many.

codeone
02-04-2009, 04:59 PM
Well, I'd be curious to know just how many areas REQUIRE an outside disconnect. I don't think it's many.


The NEC doesnt require it. Most places adopt the NEC in this country.
I would also be curious how many if any really require it. If they do it would be nice to see it in writing ( their statutes )

jbfan74
02-04-2009, 07:15 PM
Well, I'd be curious to know just how many areas REQUIRE an outside disconnect. I don't think it's many.

All over the great state of GA!
In the places I have worked anyway!

hj
02-05-2009, 06:21 AM
The meter is NEVER a disconnect point, and here, if you were to break the meter seal to remove it, you would be eligible for a $10,000 fine. The disconnect, whatever type it is, MUST be adjacent to the meter with the minimum distance between it and the meter. Here we usually use a combination meter socket and circuit breaker panel with a main breaker. But if the situation requires it, then separate devices are used, but the main breaker's position never changes.

Scuba_Dave
02-05-2009, 06:29 AM
I actually meant as a disconnect for the POCO - at least around here
Around here nothing is outside except the meter
And in some really old houses the meters used to be inside

You pull a meter base out, isn't there some chance of arcing?

PeteD
02-05-2009, 07:03 AM
I actually meant as a disconnect for the POCO - at least around here
Around here nothing is outside except the meter
And in some really old houses the meters used to be inside

You pull a meter base out, isn't there some chance of arcing?

I have a main breaker outside next to the meter. House was built in early 1990s.

Edit:

I believe this has to do with my main panel being a good 20 plus feet from the outside service...

codeone
02-06-2009, 07:33 PM
VI. Service Equipment - Disconnecting Means
230.70 General. Means shall be provided to disconnect all
conductors in a building or other structure from the serviceentrance
conductors.
(A) Location. The· service disconnecting means shall be
installed in accordance with 230.70(A)(l), (A)(2), and
(A)(3).
(1) Readily Accessible Location. The service disconnecting
means shall be installed at a readily accessible location
either outside of a building or structure or inside nearest the
point of entrance of the service conductors.
(2) Bathrooms. Service disconnecting means shall not be
installed in bathrooms.
(3) Remote Control. Where a remote control device(s) is
used to actuate the service disconnecting means, the service
disconnecting means shall be located in accordance with
230.70(A)(1).
(D) Marknng. Each service disconnect shall be permanently
marked to identify it as a service disconnect.
(C) Suitable for Use. Each service disconnecting means
shall be suitable for the prevailing conditions. Service
equipment installed in hazardous (classified) locations shall
comply with the requirements of Articles 500 through 517

This is from the 2008 NEC

Scuba_Dave
02-06-2009, 08:20 PM
Ah, OK - mine is right inside close to where the service enters
Just enough room for a 90 elbow pointing down

hj
02-07-2009, 07:26 AM
Here, I believe it is a power company requirement and they will not set the meter without it, but it would not have gotten to the meter setting stage anyway if it were not there.

220/221
02-07-2009, 10:33 AM
You pull a meter base out, isn't there some chance of arcing?

If there is a load, it will arc. The bigger the load the bigger the arc.

jaxbldginspector
02-11-2009, 08:10 PM
its all my fault

codeone
02-14-2009, 05:09 PM
The power co can pull the disconnect at the transformer if they need to to pull the meter. No need for a disconnect at the meter for them some areas the co's may require or local code the NEC does not it can be at the closest point inside the house per the 2008 and 2005 NEC codes.