Ejector Pit Question

04-14-08

Hello all, I am new here.

I am going to install an ejector pit this summer in our basement floor. A few questions:

1. What do I use to connect the PVC pipe from the Shower, Toilet and Sink to the 4" hole in the basin? There must be a special connector/coupling/bushing...as the basin has a rounded surface. How is a seal made between the PVC pipe and the hole in the basin?

2. I have read that the check valve should be installed horizontally. Should it not be vertical so the flap door inside falls downward? If the valve was mounted horizontally couldn't the flap door sometimes be open a bit?

Thanks!
Dan

pit

If you have to ask that question, since it is the most elementary one in the whole installation, maybe you should not be doing this yourself.

Surprised at your stupid answer !!!!!!

No kidding?

So, you don't answer "stupid" questions. Is that the feeling here at Terry Love's forum? How would you know what I can and cannot handle? What makes you the judge here?

Would anyone else care to offer some help here or am I stuck with this jerk moderator's idiotic response?????

I'd be glad to leave this site and seek the information elsewhere if no one would want to step up to the plate.

I install all my 2" checkvalves in the verticle position, just below the grate, and just above the little hole I put into the discharge.

I install horizontal backwater valves on 3 or 4 discharges, mostly on area drains.

The gravity of the water will hold the check closed.

hj said:

If you have to ask that question, since it is the most elementary one in the whole installation, maybe you should not be doing this yourself.

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I agree.

Some things people just should not do.

I have seen some very interesting things in my time. And when I was ont he phone with the customer, I was re-assured that he had it under control and it was easy, he just didn't understand what went wrong?

In response

I would like to remind all that the name of this forum is: "Terry Love's Plumbing & Remodel DIY advice forum".


I am a dedicated Do It Yourself person. I need to be, because it is one way that we can afford our home. Everything that I do whether it be electrical or plumbing (I won't touch gas) I do with a permit from our village. The inspector comes out before I start a project and I go over my plans with him and then when the project is complete he comes back out and inspects my work. I spend a long time researching my projects and I always seek the knowledge and advise of professionals. One reason I go to these great lengths is because of a concern for liability and safty.

One thing I've learned in my business is that when a customer wants to ask me a question I make sure that I am approachable to that customer. This is one of the keys to repeat business. I do good work and because of that I know I will always have work. I have no problem at all sharing my knowledge with others.

My questions to this forum were simple and they deserve simple and understandable responses. Whether or not I do it right is my business. I just came to the forum for some simple answers and what I got was a debate. Think I'll just leave and seek help elsewhere.

Later.

dan2004 said:

I would like to remind all that the name of this forum is: "Terry Love's Plumbing & Remodel DIY advice forum".


I am a dedicated Do It Yourself person. I need to be, because it is one way that we can afford our home. Everything that I do whether it be electrical or plumbing (I won't touch gas) I do with a permit from our village. The inspector comes out before I start a project and I go over my plans with him and then when the project is complete he comes back out and inspects my work. I spend a long time researching my projects and I always seek the knowledge and advise of professionals. One reason I go to these great lengths is because of a concern for liability and safty.

One thing I've learned in my business is that when a customer wants to ask me a question I make sure that I am approachable to that customer. This is one of the keys to repeat business. I do good work and because of that I know I will always have work. I have no problem at all sharing my knowledge with others.

My questions to this forum were simple and they deserve simple and understandable responses. Whether or not I do it right is my business. I just came to the forum for some simple answers and what I got was a debate. Think I'll just leave and seek help elsewhere.

Later.

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should I re-quote my response????

fixing toilets or leaking faucets is not like installing a sewage ejector. it's called public health

you have pump and pit size, head, discharge, backup pump or alarm requirments.

you asked a very simple question, so who is to know how you figured out the harder answers

enjoy, take it for what it is, it's your health.

advice

I would like to remind all that the name of this forum is: "Terry Love's Plumbing & Remodel DIY advice forum".

That is what this site is and our advice to a DIY is that if you could do it, you would not have to ask that question, since it is the easiest part of the job. Advice is not always instruction on how to perform a task. Sometimes it involves advising someone who is being illogical as far as the task is concerned. The ejector basin will come with a port and the device to connect the pipe. Now what are you going to do to get the pipe to the basin? Just start hooking fittings together until you get where you want to go? If you do it that way, it will also be an easy installation, but not one that most people, or plumbers, would be proud of.

dan2004 said:

I would like to remind all that the name of this forum is: "Terry Love's Plumbing & Remodel DIY advice forum".


I am a dedicated Do It Yourself person. I need to be, because it is one way that we can afford our home. Everything that I do whether it be electrical or plumbing (I won't touch gas) I do with a permit from our village. The inspector comes out before I start a project and I go over my plans with him and then when the project is complete he comes back out and inspects my work. I spend a long time researching my projects and I always seek the knowledge and advise of professionals. One reason I go to these great lengths is because of a concern for liability and safty.

One thing I've learned in my business is that when a customer wants to ask me a question I make sure that I am approachable to that customer. This is one of the keys to repeat business. I do good work and because of that I know I will always have work. I have no problem at all sharing my knowledge with others.

My questions to this forum were simple and they deserve simple and understandable responses. Whether or not I do it right is my business. I just came to the forum for some simple answers and what I got was a debate. Think I'll just leave and seek help elsewhere.

Later.

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You are not a customer, a customer pays for a product or service.
You are asking for someone else's knowledge and training to tell you how to design and instal your ejector pump.

Simple by your standards but technical by the trade.

This reminds me of my aunt who asks if I can look up a website for her. I say sure, whats the website. WWW.something or other. Right, like there aren't over a million websites out there.

Dan-
Don't get all fired up. FWIW, I did the exact same project you are embarking on and I posted similar 'dumb' questions (I'm a diyer). I reacted the same way when I started lurking and posting here when guys like HJ used certain tones. But they deal with a lot of stupid diyers. (Not saying I'm NOT one...)

My advice is to be thickskinned and do a lot of lurking and reading (get some basic plumbing books from BORG and a copy of CodeCheck).

While there may be nicer ways to suggest 'Please do a little more homework before posting', the amount of quality, free advice these guys give more than entitles them to a little flippancy now and then. I'd just accept it and don't provoke. Not worth it.

To answer yr q's:

1) The basin should include a rubber gasket. The pvc line fits into the gasketed hole with friction.

2) You'll find lots of opinions about whether it's better to vert or horiz mount the c-valve. Get a good, fullswing check valve and just follow the manufacturer's instructions.

Oh yeah, one pc of advice:

Don't chinse out on yr pump. I just bought a Zoeller with a piggyback switch to replace my failed Flotec (lasted 2 years).

quote

A man has got to know his limitations... ~Dirty Harry

Stop what you are doing at least 2 minutes before you reach your level of incompetence. Clean Harry.

Thanks Prashter

Prashter

Thank you, I appreciate your thoughtful advice.

I have been doing a lot of research and am finding lots of options. I'll probably just go and talk to a guy that has been running a plumbing supply house in our area for 30 something years. He's a real nice guy and is always very helpful. Probably should have started there in the first place. I guess I lost my cool because it is very aggrevating when you go to a person who prides himself with the knowledge that he possesses and wants to offer that advice whether it be as a Moderator or other Forum participant and then he tries to make you feel like an idiot for asking a simple basic question. In hindsight I look back and think that it was not in my personal interest to get upset with a bunch of guys whose extent of trying to philosopically open my eyes are with some old rusty quotes from an old early 70's movie. I'm through responding to those guys. Enough said....

In the research that I have done, there are varying opinions on how to mount the check valve. Some say vertical, some say horizontal. Some diagrams even show it mounted inside the basin but most show it mounted outside of the basin. It would seem that in the horizontal position the flap could possibilty stay cracked open allowing gas to migrate back to the basin. I know that proper venting would negate this potential problem, I just wanted some clarification about that from the pros.

When I was looking at sewage basins at Home Depot, and Lowes all had the 4" inlet hole in them but none of the stores sold the required fitting to connect the PVC pipe to the basin. (I am referring to the side of the basin where wastewater flows into the basin) I just wanted to know where to look for that. There is no information that I can find anywhere on the WEB. I've gone to manufacturer's web sites and looked in their .pdf manuals for ejector pumps and pump packages and there is no mention of what to use.

Thank you again sir, I'm sure this will not be a problem.
Dan

You want the checkvalve outside of the basin so you can do maintenace on the basin without umpteen gallons of sewage falling back into the pit. Follow the manufacturer's instructions on orientation for whatever you choose on the checkvalve.

Full swing valves are mounted at 45 degrees, so whether you hang them vert or horiz, the lid hangs at 45 deg to the floor. I mounted mine vertically for the nonscientific reason that when it shuts off, there's a column of water on top of the valve which blocks sewer gasses.

That being said, whenever I've had to get into the pit, the vertical orientation means I gotta deal with that column when unscrewing the valve.

The problem is that you need to do your homework and have a damn good idea of what you are doing. Mabe sketches of your plans, components you are planning on using and the whole bit. You can't just plop in and say I want to repipe my whole house, how do I sweat a copper joint? You're definitely not going to like the answer! We're very ready to give advice on points but not how to do a complete job!

THe quality of the pits sold at big box leave a little to be desired Go down to the supply house talk to your friendly counterman see what he has to offer! Chances are he will not have a Flotec (Cheapo) pit, but instead will probably show you one of these...http://www.zoeller.com/zcopump/products/package/Simplex.htm



Notice the part for conecting the pipe is already there...

That being said, whenever I've had to get into the pit, the vertical orientation means I gotta deal with that column when unscrewing the valve.

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Prashster, One of the points you missed is that there should be a valve installed above the check valve so changing out a check valve doesn't mean dealing with a 20' tall 2" line full of poop!



The check valve in this picture is one that I have been installing on sump pumps and ejector pumps. It is a quiet check valve that works without that familiar thump and shaking pipe. http://www.aymcdonald.com/ProdList_Plumbing.cfm?getgroup=73&sendCat=13

Yeah, I misspoke. I installed my gate valve about 6" above the cv, thinking it was close enough. I wish I had mounted it closer.

Thanks

Redwood, Prashter, Jadnashua

Thanks!
Dan