View Full Version : Toto MS853113 Lethargic Flush

03-16-2008, 09:37 AM

My contractor recently completed my master bathroom, looks and functions great except for the flushing action of the new Toto MS853113. It can only be described as lethargic, the water doesnít seem to spin in the bowl and the duration is extremely short. Contractor says thatís the way this bowl works, thereís nothing he can do about it.
The sinks and shower in the master bathroom all drain properly as well as the main bathroom adjacent to the master. The main bathrooms toilet, a Kohler, functions properly no complaints. My wife said she noticed some movement in the main bathroom when we flush the Toto in the master, could this be a clue?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.


03-16-2008, 01:13 PM
The Toto Ultimate did not sell as fast in the beginning because the flush was considered somewhat subtle in the showrooms.
Most of the flush action takes place below the water surface.
If you were to put your hand down there (That's right, just put your hand in the toilet bowl) you would notice a surge of water going through the bottom of the bowl from the "siphon" jet.

There is nothing wrong, it's working well, but different.
Sometimes "different" is good.


03-16-2008, 05:57 PM
Hi Terry,

Thank you for the quick reply! Unfortunately I don't think the flush is normal please take a look at this video I posted of my Toto in action. Doesn't seem right to me. What do you think?



03-16-2008, 06:51 PM
I would suggest that you check to see what is blocking the exit.
The last one I saw like that had the wax blocking the hole.

Most plumbers put the wax down on the floor first, and then drop the bowl down.

03-16-2008, 07:00 PM
Even with a blocked exit wouldn't you expect to see a higher volume of water entering the bowl?

Believe it or not I found another video online of the same toilet flushing and you can clearly see the water coming out from the front of the bowl into the center, mine doesn't so that.

See this video, same Toto toilet


To check for block I ran an auger into the bowl and found no obstructions.

What's next?

03-16-2008, 07:47 PM
Is the tank filling to the water line? Is the bowl refill tube in place? Was the toilet installed with a wax ring that had a black plastic horn on it?

03-16-2008, 07:51 PM
The bowl fill to about 1/4 inch below the verticle tube where the refill tube connects to.
I can't see the water line in the tank, where is it located?
The refill tube is in place.
I'm not sure of the wax ring used, I didn't do the install my contractor did.

03-16-2008, 08:18 PM
I believe there is a plastic ring on the overflow tube the tank water level should rise to.

03-17-2008, 08:27 AM
I don't see a plastic ring but the level seems ok. Have you viewed the video I posted last night? Terry believes there's something blocking the waters exit.

I called my contractor but he's not available for a while, I might have to pull the bowl myself and take a look.

03-17-2008, 08:54 AM
Yes, I would agree that the wax ring is more than likely the problem. It is either slipped out of place or, one with the blck plastic horn was used and the horn of the toilet and the flange are pinching it closed. This is quite common with the super toilets and smaller flanges.

Gary Swart
03-17-2008, 09:00 AM
Pulling a toilet and resetting it is really a pretty simple task. If it were mine, I'd do it. Once it is up, check the trap from the underside to make certain there is no blockage like a toothbrush, toy, etc.. Reset the toilet with a wax ring that does not have the plastic horn. Those seem like a good idea when you look at them, but they cause problems. You may find nothing amiss, but you will have the peace of mind that you looked.

03-17-2008, 10:05 AM
Looks like I have another project to add to the list :)

Is it still proper procedure to set the toilet in a bed of plaster? My Dad tought me this a long time ago when I was a kid.

Thank you,

03-17-2008, 11:50 AM
Only if the floor is way off level! I usually shim if needed and caulk.


Gary Swart
03-17-2008, 12:06 PM
To check for level, set the toilet in place without the wax ring and see if it sets solidly on the floor all around. If not, shim the low spots. You could run a bead of caulking on the floor where the toilet will set, then after the toilet is in place, run a bead of caulking around the outside edge. Some guys run the caulk all around, some leave the backside uncaulked. I go all around mine because I want to keep any spilled water from getting under the toilet because it is over a ceiling that I sure don't want ruined.

03-20-2008, 05:16 AM
Problem solved!
I removed the toilet last night and found a partially obstructed water exit. The wax ring had been pinched during the install and was covering about 1/3 of the exit, enough to interfere with the flushing action.

Thank you for your advice!

03-20-2008, 06:18 AM
Every manufacturer occassionally has a QC problem, but Toto's percentage is possibly the best in the industry...something obvious like that would have been caught before it left the factory, so it was a high probability it was either with the install, or a clogged pipe. Glad it worked out...I think you'll like it...both my mother's remodel and mine have worked out well.