Moentrol - pulling cart prior to soldering?!

[nivlek]

Hi - I have what appears to be a rather difficult time doing something apparently very simple. I am attempting to pull the two cartridges from a Moentrol valve in preparation of pipe soldering.

The instruction pamphlet indicates that this is accomplished is two easy steps:

1. remove the two retainer clips (check) and

2. use a pair of pliers to remove the cartridge from the valve body.

However, no amount of pulling seems to budge the cartridges. They turn just fine and the "pin" moves in and out, but neither cartridge will actually slide out. I referenced the Moen website and while no instructions for the Moentrol unit were available, a number of animated sequences showing similar removal were seen. The pliers that I am using are garden variety and are starting to leave small scrapes on the brass finish. Not wanting to continue damaging the surface, I elected to get smart and seek advice.

Any help, especially pointing out any or all of my stupid over-sight(s), would be greatly appreciated!

Kelvin

[Dunbar Plumbing]

Take the screw that's intended to hold the handle on and screw it into the end of the stem so you don't mess that up.


First I've heard of someone having trouble initially with a moen from the go; it's usually years later when you absolutely cannot get them to budge.

Go to your local plumbing supply and get a cartridge pullerhttp://re3.mm-a7.yimg.com/image/3762853537; they work quite well in this application and will remove that cartridge without further adieu.

[nivlek]

Thanks Rugged,

Is this tool available at Home Depot or should I seek a specialty plumbing supplier?

Also, if the cartridge is "stuck" does that also mean that it is broken or defective. I guess the question is, do I need to replace the cartridges prior to reinserting them into the valve assembly?

[Dunbar Plumbing]

Yes......it's a very common item needed for moen faucets.

No....it's a trademark problem with moen that'll never go away. Thus the reason there's a market for making the tools to remove the cartridge. :(

[nivlek]

I guess the Moen kids have to eat too, right... ;)

[hj]

You mention "2 clips", " 2 cartridges", etc., but the Moentrol only has one cartridge and a balancing spool. If you intend to overheat the valve then you should unscrew the balancing spool also.

[Lancaster]

Poster probably has the Moentrol with the transfer valve attached.That has two cartridges.

[hj]

if you mean the diverter, it screws in, so it is not held with a clip.

[Lancaster]

http://www.faucet-warehouse.com/products/moen/3320.gif

[hj]

Interesting, and the first one I have seen like that. It also appears to be a "dumb idea" if those are not check/stops, because if the upper one is used to turn the shower on and off, then it creates a cross connection. If I ever install one I will have to check the dynamics to see exactly how it works.

[nivlek]

Yes, that is the unit in question (Moen part no. 3330). I discussed with the person on at HD the relevant problem of non-removable cartridges. He told me that Moen has told him in the past that tapping the outside perimeter of the valve lightly with a hammer will loosen the factory seal and then permit the unit to come out.

[cwhyu2]

The cartrages in that model are 1225s .The puller you saw on this will pull
them right out if used properly.The big slotted cover to left of mixing
valve contains the balancing piston.The other two are stops to turn off
valve for testing and repairs.Make sure clip are pulled.Ihave insalled
repaired several hundred of Moen faucets of all types.

[dsavy86]

Although perhaps not a suggested method, if done CAREFULLY, you may put the valve on the ground and brace it between your feet. Then put your channel locks on the cartridge stem and pull STRAIGHT up to get it out. I did this successfully the other day without damaging the unit. Seems as though they were a bit short on the grease in the factory. A puller is a good thing to have anyway, but in a pinch this method will work. A great quote from a fella I work with: "Runnin' will kill ya." True in this case when you have to go to the store for a puller, have the water off, and the wife and kiddos need it back on. Good luck.

[crosby1]

do the stop-check valves have to be removed as well prior to soldering?

thanks.

pietre.

[crosby1]

Hello? Anybody?

[jadnashua]

It somewhat depends on your skill level. They're normally robust enough to withstand it. A pro using a hotter torch and knowing what he's doing probably wouldn't remove it, as he would get it soldered fairly fast and not overheat it. You could put a damp rag on the valve to keep it cooler if there is enough distance to the fitting to keep it from getting hot enough to solder.

[crosby1]

thanks. i'm definitely not a pro, so i'll probably end up overheating the thing. i think i'll just remove all the cartridges and stop-check valves just to be on the safe side.

thanks again.

p.