Hot water issues

[lefty]

This may not seem strange to you guys but to me it is. I cannot get hot water in my kitchen sink unless I first turn on the hot water in my shower. I have plenty of water pressure on the hot water side. I have flushed the water heater just to cover that. Any ideas?

[jimbo]

Is it that you get NO water at all, or you get water but it is not hot? If the latter, does it eventually get hot if you let it run a long time?

[cwhyu2]

Several things you could look for .check shut off under k/s.If it off and
have single valve faucet it might byassing hot to cold and coming out
the cold side of the k/s faucet.More info would help.

[lefty]

I have plenty of water pressure it just doesn't get hot unless I turn on the water in the shower first.

[lefty]

I have double valve faucet with two seperate water supplies under the sink.
one hot and one cold.

[cwhyu2]

Is the shower valve single?

[lefty]

one thing, i have an expansion tank in line before the suply line gets to the water heater. It is warm and when I turn on the hot water I can put my hand on it and it doesn't feel anything is leaving it and also it doesn't cool off any. could it be stopped up and could that be the culprit?

[lefty]

the shower valve also is double.

[cwhyu2]

How old is the w/h?

[GrumpyPlumber]

One VERY good question...you say you get no hot water at the KS faucet...are you getting ANY water on the hot side when the shower is off?

[lefty]

about a yr old give or take a little bit. It's a State Select 40 gal.

[cwhyu2]

Ok I thougt abuot long hard .You may have a broken off dip tube inside
the w/h.It can cause cold to become warm.look up w/h and
expansion tanks.This may help better under stand how they work.

[lefty]

yes I get water with good pressure on the hot side of the k/s when the shower is not on. It's like I have to prime it by turning the hot water on in the shower to make it get hot in the sink. Then it gets hot. I turn the shower off the water in the sink cools to luke-warm.

[lefty]

I will check although, the shower water stays hot, way longer than it has to. it is only in the kitchen sink that it either isn't getting hot or isn't staying hot without the hot side of the shower turned on.

[GrumpyPlumber]

This sound slike you might have trouble at the shower valve.."path of least resistance" type trouble.
If the shower valve is allowing cold to get by into the hot line and it's less distance, fewer offests or larger pipe..(a few other variables) the cold is possibley cross feeding into the hot side through the shower...when you open the shower it closes the cross connection...you might start by letting us know what type shopwer valve it is.
If it has a balancing cartridge, that could be the trouble...cartridge might be ceased...partially of fully.

[cwhyu2]

the shower valve also is double.
Is the washing machine a 2 valve or single ?This may be your bypass.

[master plumber mark]

chyu2 is probably right on. with his diagnosis.

turn off the washing machine at the valves....

see if their is any change in the hot water to the

kitchen...

[GrumpyPlumber]

Kinda funny, each of these scenario's are things I think each of us would look for if on the job.
I just don't see how turning the hot on in the shower could cause a laundry valve to bypass and allow hot to flow...I stand with my "guestimate" that the trouble is at the shower valve...even though it's not a single handle I'm guessing the cold is somehow crossing to hot in the the closed position.
There are too many variables to come to a quick, definitive conclusion by eeking out details one post at a time.
Opening the hot on the shower would only further enhance the trouble if it were the laundry by reducing volume on the hot at the kitchen.
For fun we could wager..."gentlemens bets".

[lefty]

well... I do not have hot water going to my washer. never have had, never connected it as my better half washes EVERYTHING in cold water. as for the shower i have no idea what kind it is its in the wall on the other side of the tile, I can tell you only that thereis 2 supply lines running to it, one hot, one cold. this is how my layout is when talking about one being closer to the water heater than the other utillity room with water heater--- washer-----------------kitchen sink---------- Shower.
The shower being the farthest thing from the water heater, the washing machine the closest, with the kitchen sink about 3/4 of the way between the shower and water heater.
like i told you earlier, this morning Iflushed the water heater and it had only minimal effect. now, however, the water gets hot. i made no other changes in anything anywhere. this house is older, built in 1969. plumbing and wiring are two projects I'm going to have to face in the near future I think wiring will come first because it would upset me greatly to burn my house down right after I redid my plumbing.
I'd love to know what caused this problem, maybe it was the sediment in the tank. Thats the only thing I did. Thanks

[GrumpyPlumber]

Other point too...his interpretation of "double" handle...could be a valve with seperate diverter/temperature setting.

[cwhyu2]

Did that work ? If not I will try to think of something else.

[lefty]

well if I have further issues with it I reckon I'll have to bite the bullet and call in a plumber. You can count on me letting you know what it ends up being. I know it is difficult to diagnose not seeing it with your own eyes and my terminology leaves a lot to be desired. I am having some pressure related problems in general and it could be related. The city has increased the water pressure by installing a larger main so that people up on the hill will have more pressure. I had a pressure regulator installed at my meter but I think it has gone bad.

[markts30]

Could be an obstruction in the pipe...
Hot flow to the shower moves the obstruction from the supply tee to the sink allowing the hot water to flow...
When the shower is off, the obstruction plugs the hot supply at the tee...

[GrumpyPlumber]

All I know is I really hope he lets us know what it was...this beats the heck outta crossword puzzles any day.

[Verdeboy]

For fun we could wager..."gentlemens bets".
I'm betting on MarkTS, especially if there are old galvy pipes involved.

[GrumpyPlumber]

I'm betting on MarkTS, especially if there are old galvy pipes involved.

With his track record, I'd be with ya, but I'm too stubborn to not bet on myself.
...Lets just hope he comes back with a lil' "closure" as Oprah would say.

[tviapiano]

With his track record, I'd be with ya, but I'm too stubborn to not bet on myself.
...Lets just hope he comes back with a lil' "closure" as Oprah would say.

I don't know.. I'm still waiting for closure on:
http://www.terrylove.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13864

:)