Leaking G-Max or Power Gravity Fill Valve.

[jt3]

Recently installed a new Ultramax with the G-Max fill valve. Initially the tank filled to the very top of the flush tower / overflow tube and you could hear and see the water running over the top and down to the bowl. Adjusted the fill valve so that the water stops at the line on the fill tube that is about 1/2" below the top. Everything appears fine after the flush. Water stops at correct level and the bowl fill line shuts off. After 5 to 10 minutes, water starts dripping out of the bowl fill line and must also be coming out of the fill valve because the water slowly rises in the tank until it is weeping over the top of the overflow. (Takes between 30 and 60 minutes to reach top of overflow, haven't really timed it)

Fill valve is not the "Korky" type shown in several posts but is flat on the top and says G-Max. Is this unit serviceable like the Korky valve or do I need to contact the retailer and get a new valve? If it is servicable, a diagram would be nice if available.

Thanks,

jt3

[Terry]

http://www.terrylove.com/korky/korky_cap.jpg


www.terrylove.com/korky (http://www.terrylove.com/korky)

Sometimes just cleaning the assembly cap works.
The instructions for the Korky/Hunter work on this.
You don't need tools for this.
If you need a new cap, Lowes sells it for $2.47
On a new valve though, it's more likely some dirt is the problem.

http://www.terrylove.com/images/hunter/hunter_exploded.jpg

[jt3]

Thanks Terry,

Tried your suggestion but the inside of the mechanism is a little different from the Korky and I don't want to force (and possibly break it) unless I have a replacement handy)

Finally got a reply back from Toto (E-Mail problems) and called their Tech Support person. His suggestion before replacing the valve was to check the screen at the bottom of the unit where the supply line connects and he also questioned the water pressure. Since we have very good water pressure here (85 to 100 psi) that could be the problem. May need to install a pressure regulator / reducer on the line to reduce the pressure to something around 50 to 60 psi.

Will probably pickup one of the "Korky" valves first and try that. (Least expensive to start) If it still bleeds by, will have to install a regulator.

Will let you know how things work out.

Jim

[Terry]

Most codes require that anything over 80 psi should have a pressure reducer and an expansion tank.

If you have the non-Korky style fill valve, then don't try taking it apart.

[xmcspc]

I also recently installed a brand-new Toto Ultramax with G-Max fill valve, and have had nothing but problems with the fill valve leaking. Toto tech support has been very responsive, and has sent out multiple replacement fill valves. All have shown the same symptoms... works fine for 1-2 weeks, then starts leaking.

The symtpoms are exactly as jt3 describes... water fills quickly to the proper level, then shuts off. Over anywhere from 10-30 minutes, the water slowly creeps up the fill tube, then overflows. The interesting thing is that water does not drip from around the top of the valve or the fill tube itself. I spent a bit of time troubleshooting and the water is coming from the base of the tall "tube" that forms the upright part of the fill valve assembly. Having several discarded G-Max valves on hand, I took one apart and it seems that the only way water can come from this part of the fill valve is if one of the two the largest internal rubber seals is slightly out-of-spec (i.e. thin).

I'm beginning to think there is a manufacturing defect in the fill valves. I could understand how one valve might leak... but I'm currently on my 3rd fill valve in 3 months.

I definitely want to keep the Ultramax, it's a great toilet. Now I'm researching repacement valves. Anyone know know a Canadian distributor for Korky's? The Home Depots in my area (Western Canada) don't carry them...

Oh... and if you have a recently-installed Toto with G-Max... you should check to make sure it's not leaking... this is a very silent leak and could easily go unnoticed.

[Peanut9199]

They don't have them in the big box stores in Canada they want you to go through plumbing retail or boutiques.

The only time i have seen the fill valves fail is from the diaphram cap.
If it continues to run and you replaced the fill valve 3 times you might want to check the Flapper. It may be losing water if the flapper is not sitting properly or even the flush valve may not be smooth and water is escaping from there as well.

Call Toto and ask them for part # THU013Z which is the flush valve assembly. If they question you tell them the fill valve runs over time and you replaced the fill valve already, they should send you out this part.

www.terrylove.com/korky (http://www.terrylove.com/korky)

[jadnashua]

Buy a water pressure gauge and check out your static water pressure. It could be exceptionally high, and that is what is giving you problems. You may need a pressure reduction valve. Around here, you can buy a gauge for around $10 US at HD. It will screw into a hose bib, either outside or at the washing machine, and other places if you buy adapters. If the pressure is above 80 pounds, you need a prv.

[xmcspc]

Thanks for the advice. I'll check the pressure. Even if it is high, I wouldn't expect the more expensive Toto to be affected by it when my substantially-less-expensive (and 15 to 40 year old) other brand-name toilets handle the same pressure just fine.

Also... I discovered a neighbour (same water pressure) has an Ultramax with the older-style (Korky? - definitely not "GMax") fill valve. It's a couple of years old and has never had a problem with the fill valve.

With respect to the flush valve, if I turn off the supply water, the water level in the tank doesn't drop, so my interpretation is that the flapper/flush valve isn't leaking.

[Dunbar Plumbing]

I'll check the pressure. Even if it is high, I wouldn't expect the more expensive Toto to be affected by it when my less-expensive American Standards handle the same pressure just fine.




That's a bad draw comparison in your statement regarding pressure.

It's very possible and likely to overpressure old tires on a car and never have a blowout, do the same thing with new tires and a blowout occurs.

60psi is what all plumbing fixtures/valves/stops along with dishwashers/washing machines are engineered for.

If you are running well above that in regards to high pressure and discounting logical thinking, put the american standard toilets back in.

High water pressure if that is your situation can greatly affect the operation of fill valves........korky and fluidmaster. They take a beating when those valves close.


Dirt in Korky assemblies will cause some really strange occurrences when they stop working. Almost like a teeter-totter fill and they significantly reduce the bowl refill for the next flush. Did one last week, caused solely by fire hydrant draining. I could of cleaned it and reinstalled but I didn't want it to happen twice........2nd time would be my freebie for not following standard procedure.

[xmcspc]

Thanks for the info, Rugged. Much appreciated.

I purchased a pressure gauge and measured 100psi at my outside hose bib. I was quite surprised to see it that high. I've schedule an install of a pressure reducing valve.

[jadnashua]

Remember, with the PRV, you MUST also install an expansion tank, or you'll get even higher pressures when the water heater is running...the cold water getting heated will drive the pressure up and cause the T&P valve on the WH to leak.

[tnedb]

Terry and everyone else...
My G-Max would "pulse" when refilling the tank after a flush--at about one second intervals--on / off, etc., until the tank was full, then it would cut-off normally--no leaks. I have 2 UltaMax toilets, 4yrs. old, same problem. I was completely baffled, and had never opened up a G-Max valve. I stumbled on this thread Saturday morning, and since my problem was similar, I thought I'd take the valve apart. Looking at the old valve, the pattern of the tube was imprinted upon the rubber in the cap. I had no point of reference (thought this pattern was normal) until I looked at the new valve at Lowe's--no imprints! I know now that the imprint was causing the leak--but never saw that referenced in the discussion. Needless to say, I replaced both caps, both toilets refill just fine now, and I just wanted y'all to know that this "pulsing" exists, a new cap will fix the problem, and that the rubber in the cap is not imprinted with any type of pattern from the mfg. if you have never seen a "virgin" one.
Thanks so much...
tnedb in TN

[Jack D]

How can I stop this from dripping? Water is dripping from the Refill Tube into the overflow pipe.

[jadnashua]

Two things come to mind: your house water pressure may exceed the 80# normally considered the max for a home, or the seal in the fill valve may have some debris (maybe a sand or mineral particle) caught in it, and it can't seal, or the seal is worn. They usually last longer than that. If the valve is the one made for them by Korky, the solution is probably a new seal cap, available at Lowes, or any plumbing supply, and some hardware stores for less than $3. It can be changed in a minute or so, once you figure it out (the instructions are on the package). If you're really lucky, you can take the existing one off, wipe away or rinse away some debris, and put it back, and it works...usually doesn't work, but does sometimes and costs nothing. Then, when you do buy a new one, you'll know how to replace it!

If your water pressure is too high, it gets more complicated, and you need a pressure reduction valve (for the whole house), and an expansion tank. If you already have a PRV and expansion tank, the PRV could be shot, or the expansion tank may need service, or replacing. The toilet fill valves are rated for 'normal' water presssure, and may be the weakest link, and only leaking when the pressure is high. You might want to pick up a water pressure gauge (get one with a tattle tale hand), hook it up somewhere (hose bib, washing machine, drain of the WH or anywhere with adapters) and leave it for a day or so and monitor it and check the tattle tale to see what the pressure is doing.

[jerfrank]

Hi: I have a problem with a GMAX?Korky Quitefill toilet tank fill valve. After seven years of never having a problem, I found that the water level was too high and was flowing into the overflow pipe. I adjusted the fill valve by lowering it and found that the water was filling higher than the water level line on the tank fill valve and, hence, continuing to go over the overflow pipe. Can this be fixed or must I buy a new valve?
Jerfrank

[Terry]

I would pop in a new assembly cap for $2.50
It's the easiest fix, takes about 30 seconds without tools.


http://www.terrylove.com/korky/korky_cap.jpg

[jerfrank]

Terry:
I have a G-Max valve. They look alike but will the korky replacement cap fit the G-Max?
Thanks
Jerfrank

[Terry]

Korky makes the fill valve
There are three brands used, but they all look different. If it looks like a Korky, then it is a Korky.
$2.50 part fixes it in less then a minute without tools.

[jerfrank]

Hi again:
This jerfrank. I replaced the valve cap and the water still came up and over the fill valve and the overflow pipe. I then examined the new Korky valve I had purchased (that's how I got the valve replacement cap since Home Depot didn't have just the valve replacement cap and there is no Lowe's near me) and noticed that the arms one squeezes to release the float were kind of squishy. I took the new toilet tank fill valve, pulled the top off and saw the the float arms were much more substantial so I put it into the old tank fill unit and, voila, no more running over. Now how long this lasts is anyone guess but if it works, I suggest some of you folks give it a try.
GOOD LUCK!

[notadiy]

I have 3 Toto toilets in the house. All installed at the same time about 6 years ago. Recently two of them started to have the same problem. When refilling the tank after a flush the water runs 1-2 seconds and then stops 1-2 seconds. It keeps doing this until the tank is full. No other problems with the toilet otherwise and the 3rd Toto does not have this problem.

Thanks!

[jadnashua]

Go to Lowes or a good hardware or plumbing supply house and pick up some cap replacements at about $2 each. If you're lucky, you can just clean the filter, but it's more likely the seal in the cap is worn. This assumes you have the Korky valve made for Toto (it doesn't have a big plastic screw on the top). No tools, and it should be as good as new for another 6-years or so (it all depends on your local water).

[srucker]

I have Toto Drake toilets in our home -- they are about a year-and-a-half old. Recently two of them have had drips. Water is dripping out of the refill tube into the overflow pipe at a pace of approximately one drip per second. It doesn't happen all of the time (sometimes it will stop after being flushed) and I can stop the drip (at least temporarily) by pushing down on the filler float. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

[jadnashua]

Assuming you have the Korky version of the valve made for Toto, the seal is an easily replaceable part which costs about $2. Takes about 30-seconds to do, maybe longer the first time you do it.

[Sami]

I have a Power Gravity Installation which worked perfectly until the toilet was lifted and resinstalled when the floor was retiled a couple of weeks ago. Now the tank fills in short intermittent spurts. It is a Toto 6.0Lpf and takes about 10 to 11 spurts of water to fill the tank to about a third of the way up. Previously the tank would fill very quickly without stopping. Now the pump starts/stops/starts/stops until the water is up to the proper level. I have tried wiggling the pump in the tank but it makes no difference. If I use my hand to put a little pressure on the top of the pump it will work properly but once I take my hand away and reflush the intermittent filling is back. I'm not a plumber and not particularly mechanical but would like to try fixing myself since it just feels like something needs to be tweaked.

[jadnashua]

Inside of the flush valve there's a float. There could be some crud in there that is inhibiting the movement of the float. Also, there could be some crud in the seal, which is easily replaceable for a few dollars (available at Lowes and many hardware stores).

[orion24]

My 5 year old drake toilet is dripping from from the black tube (from the fill valve) down into the tube connected to the flapper assembly. The water level is just up to the level of the tube after refilling. Is there an adjustment or do I need a new fill valve?

Many thanks and Happy New Year.

-orion24

[jimbo]

The fact that the water level is at the top of the overflow usually means that the fill valve is failing to turn off completely. Assuming it used to fill correctly, there is no adjustment, but the seal on that fill valve is easily replaced.

http://www.terrylove.com/korky/korky_cap.jpg

[cookn]

I have a Toto Carlyle (circa 2001) with the Gmax fill valve, that is failing. Will a Korky replacement cap work on the Toto version of the fill valve? I can't seem to find a Toto branded replacement, just a new fill valve (white screw style) that doesn't seem to be favored on these forums.

[Jim98311]

I have an Ultramax with the TSU18A fill valve, which is no longer fully filling the bowl. We have some sediment in our water and I suspect some debris is in the valve. Is there any way to take the valve apart or clean it out? The tank fills fine, it's just the bowl that is the issue.

Or does this call for a complete fill valve replacement? And if so, is the Fluidmaster 400ARHR a good replacement?

[Terry]

I've used the Korky MaxPerformance valve on the TOTO bowls. It has an adjustable bowl fill that the TOTO needs.
You can also use the Korky 528T

http://www.terrylove.com/images/korky_max.jpg

[jadnashua]

Assuming you have the Korky fill valve on your Toto, yes, the Korky replacement cap works and would be my first attempt rather than replacing the whole thing. While the one they make for Toto says Toto on it rather than Korky, they are shaped the same and take the same seal. Once you figure out how, it takes about a minute. While you've got it apart, check the screen and clean it if needed.

[feeth]

So if my toto looks like this on the inside (tsu25a), see the attached files. I can use what Terry has listed below?

I bought one of the $2.50 caps from Lowes and it appears they wont work.

TIA!




I've used the Korky MaxPerformance valve on the TOTO bowls. It has an adjustable bowl fill that the TOTO needs.
You can also use the Korky 528T

http://www.terrylove.com/images/korky_max.jpg

[jadnashua]

Toto uses a couple of different fill valves, and the one you have is not made for them by Korky...sorry. As I understand it, that one is not repairable, and if it leaks, must be replaced. You do want one either made for Toto or one that is adjustable so that you don't waste water and get a good flush. Those made for Toto balance the bowl and tank refill so both just fill when the tank shuts off flow. Otherwise, you'll either end up with dumping excess bowl water down the drain, or not having enough water there so there's a lousy flush. Korky does make a generic adjustable valve that will work with any model and may be quicker to find than the custom one for Toto. That one has a little valve you adjust to balance the flow so both the tank and the bowl fill up at the same time...should only take a couple of minutes longer than a straight replacement to get it right after a couple of test flushes. I think there's a video on their website.

[feeth]

Toto uses a couple of different fill valves, and the one you have is not made for them by Korky...sorry. As I understand it, that one is not repairable, and if it leaks, must be replaced. You do want one either made for Toto or one that is adjustable so that you don't waste water and get a good flush. Those made for Toto balance the bowl and tank refill so both just fill when the tank shuts off flow. Otherwise, you'll either end up with dumping excess bowl water down the drain, or not having enough water there so there's a lousy flush. Korky does make a generic adjustable valve that will work with any model and may be quicker to find than the custom one for Toto. That one has a little valve you adjust to balance the flow so both the tank and the bowl fill up at the same time...should only take a couple of minutes longer than a straight replacement to get it right after a couple of test flushes. I think there's a video on their website.


Thank you Jim! I installed the above pictured korky valve and everything is all well.