The other thread was getting a little long so I decided to start this one. I've had a few people ask me how much I charge "per fixture" on new construction. I've asked the same question and have heard everything from $200 to $800 per fixture. I was recently offered a project with 21 fixtures including the icemakers, HW heaters, washing machines....etc. He said that he had been paying $400 and the plumber supplied all pipe and fittings and he supplied everything else... offered me $8500 to bring it from the meter and run the drains & COPPER...he buys everything from the pipe to the fixture. Just wondering where I should be on this project. I'm thinking that I could make $6k in 2-3 weeks on this whole deal.... or would I totally lose my ass.. I've got to get insured to do the job. License and bond will cost me about $250 for next year.
Price per fixture ???
- Thread starter Randyj
- Start date
SRdenny
Plumbing Contractor
Price per fixture???
Don't go down that road. Figure what your cost of doing business is (a). Figure how many hours you have at your disposal per year (b). Devide a by b. Then and only then, do a take off of material and labor hours of the job in question. Now you can give a price for the whole job. Stay away from per fixture pricing. Too many variables are involved in any specific house to be able to accurately price by the fixture. For example, the exact same house for two different contractors would most likely cost you different amounts to complete.
Don't go down that road. Figure what your cost of doing business is (a). Figure how many hours you have at your disposal per year (b). Devide a by b. Then and only then, do a take off of material and labor hours of the job in question. Now you can give a price for the whole job. Stay away from per fixture pricing. Too many variables are involved in any specific house to be able to accurately price by the fixture. For example, the exact same house for two different contractors would most likely cost you different amounts to complete.
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Are you going to be able to run service during this time? If you can do it, do it and you will learn if it was / will be worth doing in the future. Experience with mistakes is the best teacher, except when working with explosives 
.
.Being where I am, new to the area and very little advertising I might work one or two days a week....which has been very fine with me for the past 6 months. I might not work for a month then stay busy around the clock for a week or two. I actually kinda like it like that. Last time I had a new construction job it was fairly small. I didn't have to run code vents and was able to get away with only one vent on the main line. It was an addition to an existing house. I took the job for $1700 (fuzz under $400 per fixture in CPVC/PVC) and still had to buy license. The only other bid he got was $2500 and said he could do it in 3 days. I cleared $1100 plus did another $700 in service work in the week it took me to do the job. So, this guy says this job he is offering me is a 1 1/2-2 week rough in job... I told him to plan for 3-4 weeks to allow for "just in case" stuff. To me that means "just in case I get some good service work jobs"... I figure that if I have to I can work all night long on the new construction job and take care of the few service jobs as they come.... it's all alot of guessing. I know that before I lock down a firm price I need to figure cost of materials..FOR SURE!
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TNPlumber
Plumbing Contractor
How i Price
I simply look at the job determine the cost of materials and figure, what its worth for me to do the work. The problem with doing work at a cheap price to get your foot in the door is that once you work for cheap, the contractor will expect it everytime.
I live in a county with no inspections on new construction plumbing, except for the septic tank inspection. I see a lot of shoddy work. You can separate yourself for the other guys by doing the work to code or above regardless of an inspection or not. Just my two cents worth.
Also, I work in other counties that are inspected, so it's a must for me to keep on top of the ever changing code and apply it where i work.
Scott
I simply look at the job determine the cost of materials and figure, what its worth for me to do the work. The problem with doing work at a cheap price to get your foot in the door is that once you work for cheap, the contractor will expect it everytime.
I live in a county with no inspections on new construction plumbing, except for the septic tank inspection. I see a lot of shoddy work. You can separate yourself for the other guys by doing the work to code or above regardless of an inspection or not. Just my two cents worth.
Also, I work in other counties that are inspected, so it's a must for me to keep on top of the ever changing code and apply it where i work.
Scott
Master Plumber Mark
Sensitivity trainer and plumber of mens souls
dont go down that road
any time a builder comes to me and offers me a price
to work for him, I usually cringe......
becasue their is always a reason he has "found you"
and giveing you such a "break" and favor..
probably because he has cheated everyone else in a
100 mile radius....
If you really want to turn the tables on the s.o.b
simply ask him for references.... who are some of his subs....
who was his last plumber and why isnt he useing him anymore...??
If he wont tell you who his last plumber was, that should tell you all you need to know....
Its always fun to hear the excuses why the last plumber and him
did not get along...... probably because the poor guy was never paid....
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try to Think of it this way... .
...you got to get control of the situation from the start....
or you will end up being his "boy" "chump" "go-fer" \
and get left holding the bag....ect...
REMEMEBER ----YOU are like the BANK. its your time, effort , and money he wants to borrow......
and this total stranger is like a client comming to you and asking you for a loan of your money....
if this total stranger isnt willing to fill out an application,
provide some information and background.......and expects you to
just take him at his word...... THEN HE HAS YOU IN HIS BACK POCKET
and you are going to get EXACTLY what you seserve...
any time a builder comes to me and offers me a price
to work for him, I usually cringe......
becasue their is always a reason he has "found you"
and giveing you such a "break" and favor..
probably because he has cheated everyone else in a
100 mile radius....
If you really want to turn the tables on the s.o.b
simply ask him for references.... who are some of his subs....
who was his last plumber and why isnt he useing him anymore...??
If he wont tell you who his last plumber was, that should tell you all you need to know....
Its always fun to hear the excuses why the last plumber and him
did not get along...... probably because the poor guy was never paid....
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try to Think of it this way... .
...you got to get control of the situation from the start....
or you will end up being his "boy" "chump" "go-fer" \
and get left holding the bag....ect...
REMEMEBER ----YOU are like the BANK. its your time, effort , and money he wants to borrow......
and this total stranger is like a client comming to you and asking you for a loan of your money....
if this total stranger isnt willing to fill out an application,
provide some information and background.......and expects you to
just take him at his word...... THEN HE HAS YOU IN HIS BACK POCKET
and you are going to get EXACTLY what you seserve...
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Kordts
In the Trades
Around here the price per fixture is 1000-1100 bucks. I wouldn't rough a house and let the general or the client provide material. When I look at prints, I bid high, if I get it great, but I won't lower my price just so I can keep working and break even. We deserve a markup on everything we install, because we are on the hook for it. When I first started out I played that game, then got a couple callbacks on their cheap fixtures, and didn't get paid. That cured me.
Personally... I don't warranty fixtures. I warrranty every connection that I make and only NEW work, not handyman type repairs. I can fix a leak but if they don't want the pipe replaced then it is not warranteed.
The reason this guy came to me is he had come up here to check out a job. His regular plumber is in the BIG CITY 70 miles away and doesn't want to come up here. I'm 1/2 mile away and it is on my way out of this place to ANYWHERE... I'm 7 miles from the nearest place to spend money...in the boonies, on a reservoir lake...and these are high dollar vacation homes.... and Lowe's DELIVERS! I've been wanting to get my foot in the door in this new gated community for the past two years that they've been builiding. So far 1/2 of the lots are sold so that leave the potential of alot of work for me...and not having to drive 70 miles to the big city to pick up a job here and there certainly appeals to me. I'm an internet junky. UPS and FEDEX know exactly where I live and I do alot of shopping on the phone....saves me lots of miles and is the only way I can do it. I've had to put off repair jobs for 3 days just to be able to justify making a trip to town....unless they wanted to add on $100 or more for the trip to pick up a $5 part.
The reason this guy came to me is he had come up here to check out a job. His regular plumber is in the BIG CITY 70 miles away and doesn't want to come up here. I'm 1/2 mile away and it is on my way out of this place to ANYWHERE... I'm 7 miles from the nearest place to spend money...in the boonies, on a reservoir lake...and these are high dollar vacation homes.... and Lowe's DELIVERS! I've been wanting to get my foot in the door in this new gated community for the past two years that they've been builiding. So far 1/2 of the lots are sold so that leave the potential of alot of work for me...and not having to drive 70 miles to the big city to pick up a job here and there certainly appeals to me. I'm an internet junky. UPS and FEDEX know exactly where I live and I do alot of shopping on the phone....saves me lots of miles and is the only way I can do it. I've had to put off repair jobs for 3 days just to be able to justify making a trip to town....unless they wanted to add on $100 or more for the trip to pick up a $5 part.
Cal
In the Trades
Randy ,
Don't let this guy run the ring ! You'll find yourself in the corner , gloves down ,taking punches!
Here it's $800-$1,000 per fixture. Includes Pipe , chrome cutoffs and trap.
Rough-in and set out .
Understand you want to get your foot in the door ,,,, however listen to Mark
(except about on demand water heaters ,,,, he's got issues
,sorry dude)
He's right, NO REFRENCES , NO WORK !!!! Hardest part of this job is to look someone in the eye , and say ," I'm worth this much , now you WILL pay me "
Cal
Don't let this guy run the ring ! You'll find yourself in the corner , gloves down ,taking punches!
Here it's $800-$1,000 per fixture. Includes Pipe , chrome cutoffs and trap.
Rough-in and set out .
Understand you want to get your foot in the door ,,,, however listen to Mark
(except about on demand water heaters ,,,, he's got issues
,sorry dude)He's right, NO REFRENCES , NO WORK !!!! Hardest part of this job is to look someone in the eye , and say ," I'm worth this much , now you WILL pay me "
Cal
Master Plumber Mark
Sensitivity trainer and plumber of mens souls
price per fixture
what exactly do you mean by price per fixture anyway???
I dont bid too many houses anymore...I always supply parts....
when you break it down to labor only it gets pretty murkey....
In fact in our commuity their are plumbers that will rough in a
2 1/2 bathroom two story house from the slab rough plumbing for
about $875 per house....labor only...and some can do two a week...
this work appears to be good until you factor in yourinsurance,
and the warranty on the work and call backs.. and you pay your own insurance , social ecurity, workmans comp....take all taxes out ect...
and thwy run you like dogs...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
but on average you can figure a 2 1/2 bath ranch
house in this area going for a range of 5500- 7000 depending on what extras
are included...
all you got to do is divide everything up and you can get an
idea of what each bathroom is worth.....
each bathroom works out to about 1500 with me
supplying materials...more or less....
you add in the kitchen , laundry, gas lines and
water heater...hose bibls. bypass vvalves...gas logs.. ect....
and then you can shave off whatever you feel like
depending on how much you want to work for your new
skumbag builder buddy . To get your foot in the door
Then you LOSE your ASS and try and
figure out why you did not make money like the builder told
you should have..
and then you try again and repeat the very same mistakes...
eventually you get the picture....
my moment of clarity came trudgeing through a field of mud
in a rain storm going out to the breaker box for the fifth time
that afternoon to get the power back on...
what exactly do you mean by price per fixture anyway???
I dont bid too many houses anymore...I always supply parts....
when you break it down to labor only it gets pretty murkey....
In fact in our commuity their are plumbers that will rough in a
2 1/2 bathroom two story house from the slab rough plumbing for
about $875 per house....labor only...and some can do two a week...
this work appears to be good until you factor in yourinsurance,
and the warranty on the work and call backs.. and you pay your own insurance , social ecurity, workmans comp....take all taxes out ect...
and thwy run you like dogs...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
but on average you can figure a 2 1/2 bath ranch
house in this area going for a range of 5500- 7000 depending on what extras
are included...
all you got to do is divide everything up and you can get an
idea of what each bathroom is worth.....
each bathroom works out to about 1500 with me
supplying materials...more or less....
you add in the kitchen , laundry, gas lines and
water heater...hose bibls. bypass vvalves...gas logs.. ect....
and then you can shave off whatever you feel like
depending on how much you want to work for your new
skumbag builder buddy . To get your foot in the door
Then you LOSE your ASS and try and
figure out why you did not make money like the builder told
you should have..
and then you try again and repeat the very same mistakes...
eventually you get the picture....
my moment of clarity came trudgeing through a field of mud
in a rain storm going out to the breaker box for the fifth time
that afternoon to get the power back on...
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hj
Master Plumber
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price
There is no way to accurately do it by fixture, since that price includes the piping to connect it from the other fixtures. If they are two bathrooms on opposite sides of the house it will cost more "per fixture" than if they are back to back. So you either lose money on the first one, or lose the second one because you were too high. If he wants a per fixture price, do a proper estimate of the job and then divide it by the number of fixtures. If that amount is higher than his offer forget the job.
There is no way to accurately do it by fixture, since that price includes the piping to connect it from the other fixtures. If they are two bathrooms on opposite sides of the house it will cost more "per fixture" than if they are back to back. So you either lose money on the first one, or lose the second one because you were too high. If he wants a per fixture price, do a proper estimate of the job and then divide it by the number of fixtures. If that amount is higher than his offer forget the job.
Master Plumber Mark
Sensitivity trainer and plumber of mens souls
looking someone in their EVIL EYE
the best thing you can do to findout about
a contractor is simply to CALL OTHER PLUMBERS
and ask them if they have been screwed by so+so
I found this out the hard way back in 91 when
I did a Masonic Lodje on a bid I faxed in through
the DODJE REPORTS in Indy....
I got the job , but when it was all through I had to
file a LIEN on the building for 6k....
Finally got my money from the lodje, not the contractor...
THEN, after the fact.... basically ASS BACKWARDS
I wised up and called around to a bunch of other large
plumbers and simply asked if they had done work for this fellow
in the past.....
Most Plumbers are honest good hard working people and
will tell you the truth ----especially if they have been cheated .....
all you got to do is ASK other plumbers in
business and 95% of them will tell you if they had
bad dealings with so+so
IT DOES NOT MAKE YOU LOOK STUPID OR WEAK TO ASK.....
It makes you a good business-man.....
After a few calls , it was all confirmed to me what I already
knew from my own experience....
So NOW if they wont give me references, I call about
10 -20 other plumbers in the phone book and try to
get the dirt on them...
my name begins with W, so you can figure if they have called
me , they have already screwed everyone inthe yellow pages from
the letter A through W to get to me....
HO HO HO Merry X-Mas
the best thing you can do to findout about
a contractor is simply to CALL OTHER PLUMBERS
and ask them if they have been screwed by so+so
I found this out the hard way back in 91 when
I did a Masonic Lodje on a bid I faxed in through
the DODJE REPORTS in Indy....
I got the job , but when it was all through I had to
file a LIEN on the building for 6k....
Finally got my money from the lodje, not the contractor...
THEN, after the fact.... basically ASS BACKWARDS
I wised up and called around to a bunch of other large
plumbers and simply asked if they had done work for this fellow
in the past.....
Most Plumbers are honest good hard working people and
will tell you the truth ----especially if they have been cheated .....
all you got to do is ASK other plumbers in
business and 95% of them will tell you if they had
bad dealings with so+so
IT DOES NOT MAKE YOU LOOK STUPID OR WEAK TO ASK.....
It makes you a good business-man.....
After a few calls , it was all confirmed to me what I already
knew from my own experience....
So NOW if they wont give me references, I call about
10 -20 other plumbers in the phone book and try to
get the dirt on them...
my name begins with W, so you can figure if they have called
me , they have already screwed everyone inthe yellow pages from
the letter A through W to get to me....
HO HO HO Merry X-Mas
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Very excellent suggestion. If this guy comes back to me I bet he weirds out when I ask for references... wanting me to do a $9k job and I don't know him from Josephine's house cat... The dude better be willing to sign a contract so I can get a lien on everything possible... I WILL GET MY HARD EARNED MONEY!
hj
Master Plumber
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lien
In this state, you have to file a notice, almost before you do the job, regarding a possible lien.
In this state, you have to file a notice, almost before you do the job, regarding a possible lien.
Kordts
In the Trades
I just filed my first mechanic's lien. In Illinois, a sub has 90 days after the work was performed to file it. Mine got filed on the 90th day. The general gave the customer a $3000 fixture allowance, on a remodel. He ended up with 16000 grand in fixtures. This is what the general paid at a supply house, no markup. The clown was a guy who could steer a lot of work my way. So I let the general supply the fixtures and took 10 bucks off my hourly rate. I only marked up the pipe and fittings 10%. I have been paid $5500 so far, and am still out $5400. Like Alice Cooper said, no more Mr. Niceguy.
hj
Master Plumber
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price
I would say that you started out with the intention of losing money if that is the way you priced it. If your hourly rate is correct for your company, then why would you cut it? Especially for a long term job where that reduction would amount to a sizable amount, and then not make any profit on the materials? 10% is not a profit, it is a donation.
I would say that you started out with the intention of losing money if that is the way you priced it. If your hourly rate is correct for your company, then why would you cut it? Especially for a long term job where that reduction would amount to a sizable amount, and then not make any profit on the materials? 10% is not a profit, it is a donation.
Master Plumber Mark
Sensitivity trainer and plumber of mens souls
everyone makes a deal with the devil.....
KORDTS
dont feel bad about the situation you are presently in...
I have been there and waited till the last day too...
in fact the skumbags had me out bidding many other jobs
the whole time they owed me money hopeing to mess
with my mind.....thinking I woiuld not have the balls to
file the lien cause it would make them mad at me and I would
lose all this other work....yea right.....
THAT IS THE GAME THE DEVIL PLAYS WITH YOU
They have no intentin to pay their bills unless you are willing
to force them and put all their bullshit lies on the line
IT IS ALL BUSINESS......
and it is a very hard lesson to learn.
KORDTS
dont feel bad about the situation you are presently in...
I have been there and waited till the last day too...
in fact the skumbags had me out bidding many other jobs
the whole time they owed me money hopeing to mess
with my mind.....thinking I woiuld not have the balls to
file the lien cause it would make them mad at me and I would
lose all this other work....yea right.....
THAT IS THE GAME THE DEVIL PLAYS WITH YOU
They have no intentin to pay their bills unless you are willing
to force them and put all their bullshit lies on the line
IT IS ALL BUSINESS......
and it is a very hard lesson to learn.
Dunbar Plumbing
Master Plumber
The first of the year I won't be doing any work for small businesses/restaurants/hair shops unless they are repeat customers.
Anytime I hear my money is coming from corporate offices I won't blink and eye and tell them to find another.
When I used to do remodel jobs involving bathrooms or other involved jobs I would quote around $750 a fixture opening with them supplying faucet and tub/shower units. I was high but I had a good reputation for doing good work.
Anything over $500 in work I require payment immediately; not going to play games with money anymore and builders are the worst.
Every once in a while I get a lone rebel calling asking if they can bring the prints over so I can give them "best price".
The phone call ends quite quickly when I say "double and up front" is how I'm getting paid.
Puts the ignorance right where it belongs. I don't even bother with remodels where the homeowner is wanting someone to set fixtures; they are in that "quote" bubble of happiness where the cheap is all they care about.
Not my bubble of vision and I employ others with the simple no.
Anytime I hear my money is coming from corporate offices I won't blink and eye and tell them to find another.
When I used to do remodel jobs involving bathrooms or other involved jobs I would quote around $750 a fixture opening with them supplying faucet and tub/shower units. I was high but I had a good reputation for doing good work.
Anything over $500 in work I require payment immediately; not going to play games with money anymore and builders are the worst.
Every once in a while I get a lone rebel calling asking if they can bring the prints over so I can give them "best price".
The phone call ends quite quickly when I say "double and up front" is how I'm getting paid.
Puts the ignorance right where it belongs. I don't even bother with remodels where the homeowner is wanting someone to set fixtures; they are in that "quote" bubble of happiness where the cheap is all they care about.
Not my bubble of vision and I employ others with the simple no.
Thanks guys... I appreciate the heads up on the builders. I'll definitely have to know more about this builder before I get too deep. I really needed the business but since he came along I have already have had 3 calls that will keep me busy pretty much thru January doing repairs and remodels. Can just about afford to pass on this guy.
Kordts
In the Trades
hj,
this is a cautionary tale for plumbers who hear some clown try talk them into taking less money for their job because they are going to give them work in the future. I learned my lesson. Regardless, even if the guy had paid me, it still wasn't worth bending over for him.
this is a cautionary tale for plumbers who hear some clown try talk them into taking less money for their job because they are going to give them work in the future. I learned my lesson. Regardless, even if the guy had paid me, it still wasn't worth bending over for him.
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